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# 12200 - Hibbard .22 Rifle
12/30/2006
Dennis, Shawnee, KS

Hibbard - .22 LR - 24 Inches - Blue - 4070K COMPLETE # -

none I see 07-24-06 I have been trying for over a year to find any information about a .22 pump action rifle, the only markings I see are "Hibbard and Model UH" on the left side of the receiver and on the top of the barrel is ".22S.L.LR", it was made in USA and the number 4070K, which I assume is the serial number. It doesn't seem very unique but there is a large headed screw on the side of the receiver. When the screw is removed the rifle breaks down into 2 parts. Any information about this or where I could find it would be greatly appreciated. Thank you, dcb in Kansas

Answer:
Dennis- I suspect that Hibbard relates to Hibbard, Spencer & Bartlett who were Chicago retailers circa 1883 to 1929. The rifle is probably just a "store brand" variation of a model being made by Marlin, Remington, or Savage-Stevens. Check for those makers pump action .22 rifles and you will probably find one that matches yours except for the markings. John Spangler


# 12198 - Colt Revolver Marked JTT And U.S.
12/30/2006
Rita, Kaufman, Texas

Colt - 45 - 7 - Blue - 4083 -

On the Right Side are the letters Jtt and also on the right side is U.S. I would like to know what the year of the gun was made and the value and any information you can give me.

Answer:
Rita- Fortunately, we recognized the initial JTT, those of John Taliaferro Thompson, who late became famous as inventor of the Thompson Sub Machine Gun. He only inspected .45 caliber Colt revolvers of the "Model 1902" double action type which are known as Alaskan or Philippine models. About 5,000 of these were ordered in 1902, and should be in the serial number range around 43,000 to 48,000. These were ordered at a time when the Army was dissatisfied with the performance of the .38 caliber revolvers against the Moslem insurgents in the Philippines, and quickly needed something that used .45 Colt ammo again. Values vary according to condition and any alterations or damage. Lately I have seen these offered at gun shows in the range of $1,500-$2,500. John Spangler


# 11821 - Frog Gun
12/30/2006
Jerry

MAB - PA 15 M1 - 9mm - 5 - Blue - 556068 -

Three guns with consecutive serial numbers 556068, 69, and 70 I recently picked up three MAB French Model PA 15 M1 pistols. They were still in cosmoline and in unfired condition. One had some blue missing from improper storage, but otherwise, all are basically new. They are a double stack 15 round 9mm, and all have an extra magazine, and cleaning rod, but no box. I have read that these were never accepted for the French Military. Do you have any idea of the numbers produced, and where they were sold (other foreign military units?) I was told that they are rare in the US. What could be the value of these individually, and as a consecutive set? I picked them up at an estate auction at an unbelievable price for any kind of new or used pistol in good condition. I guess that there was no collector interest.

Answer:
Jerry, I am not much of a fan of the french or of most of their modern firearms. The blue book states that the P.A.- 15 is currently being used by the french military. I think that MAB pistols are rare in the U.S. because there is little demand for them. The blue book lists values for this model between $300 and $500. Marc


# 11818 - ac P.38
12/26/2006
Bradford, New Castle, VA

Walther - P 38 - 9mm - 4.75'' - Blue - 7853 g -

ac 44, eagle proof, 359 proof My father in law gave me this gun for Christmas and I am excited about owning it. His father brought it back from Germany in WWII. and has been passed through the family to me now. My father in law thinks that his dad got it from a German officer, but we cannot verify this. The gun is about 80% with a black holster and magazine pouch on the outside. The holster is probably 80% as well. My questions are as follows: 1) What does the ''g'' mean after the serial number? 2) This gun does not have the swastika proofs, does this mean that it was not a German military pistol? 3) My holster appears different than many I have seen online, inside it has what I think is ''bnz'', an eagle proof and ''P38'', what does this mean? 4) Is there anything unusual about this gun, or just a run-of-the-mill WWII P38? Thanks, Bradford

Answer:
Bradford, your P.38 was manufactured by Walther in 1944. The "ac" marking is a WW-II German ordnance code assigned to Carl Walther of Zella-Mehlis Germany and 44 is the year of manufacture. The "g" is part of your serial number, Walther and Mauser stamped the year of manufacture on the left hand side of the slide and serial numbers were reset at the beginning of each year to number 1. When the number 9999 was reached a letter suffix was added starting with "a" and so on through the alphabet.

I think that if you look closely on the left hand side of the slide and in some other places that I will mention, that will notice that there is a small swastika that you overlooked. Walther ("ac" variation) P.38 pistols should have the following markings:

  • The serial number on the slide just forward of the safety lever, on the frame above the trigger, and on the front of the barrel group below the round section of the barrel. The last three digits on the base of the barrel locking block.
  • P.38 (serial #) ac (year of manufacture) or P.38 ac (serial #) (year) on the left side of the slide.
  • Military acceptance (stamp eagle over 359) stamped twice on the right side of the slide, once on the left side of the frame above the trigger, on the left side of the barrel group, on the right side of the barrel locking block, and on the upper rear of the magazine.
  • Military test proof (eagle over a swastika) on the right side of the slide between the two stampings of the military acceptance stamp, on the left side of the barrel group, and on the left side of the barrel locking block.

For the markings on hour holster, "bnz" is the WW-II German ordnance code assigned to Steyr-Daimler-Puch AG, Steyr of Austria. Records indicate that Steyr manufactured holsters for the Polish P.35 pistol in 1944 but I could not find any information on P.38 holsters that they may have manufactured.

It sounds like you have a nice but fairly common P.38 pistol and holster. I have heard the old story about Nazi pistols being taken from German officers so many times that I have decided that the really rare pistols are those that were not captured from officers. I have never run across one that came with a story that was not purported to be captured from an officer in over 30 years of collecting. Marc


# 11817 - Zephyr Revolver
12/26/2006
Joseph Beaumont, Texas

Zephyr - Made In Germany - 22 Revolver - 2 Inch - Blue - 85869 OR 85349 -

Could you tell me what year this gun was made and some background and it is worth

Answer:
Joseph, Zephyr is a name that was used by RG - Rohm GmbH of Sontheim/Brenz Germany, they produced cheap revolvers, starting pistols, gas pistols and alarm pistols for the U.S. marketplace during the late 1960s. RG revolvers were sold in the USA prior to the passage of the 1968 Gun Control Act. Values for these revolvers is in the $25 - $50 range if you can find a buyer. Marc


# 12195 - Trapdoor Carbine With Sliding Butt Trap
12/26/2006
David

US Springfield 1873 - Trapdoor Carbine - 45/70 - 22'' - Blue - 19XXX -

Butt plate has a sliding door with a brass knob for moving and a single large hole for three piece cleaning rods. Found on page 191 of ''The .45/70 Springfield Trade edition is a clear photo of this rare modification. Say it could be done by commercial not military. When and who did the modifications?

Answer:
David- I really don't know who did these modifications. Some people think they are arsenal work, but many disagree and consider them to be gunsmith alterations. The work is not difficult, and after the Custer debacle was blamed on difficulty extracting cartridges, many folks thought it a god idea to have a cleaning rod with them at all times, in case they needed to poke out stuck cases from the chamber. There has been a lot of discussion about this issue on the excellent forum (bulletin board) at http://trapdoorcollector.com although you may have to scroll back several months to find it. Some of the most advanced experts on trapdoors made their cases there and you can decide who to believe. John Spangler


# 12189 - Wesson Hartford Target Rifle
12/23/2006
Mike, Bakersfield, California

Wesson Target Rifle - 32? - Don't Know - 62 SCRATCHED IN SEVERAL PLACES -

Ornate patch box and trigger guard. ''Wesson Hartford Connecticut'' Given a gun by my father in law before he died. He found it and some hand guns in an attic when he was 12. This gun is a target rifle with a false muzzle, which is missing. I can't find any information on this gun. It is #62 in a series. The number is scratched under the patch cover and the trigger guard. Wesson ... Hartford Connecticut is engraved in the top of the barrel. What would the value of this gun be?

Answer:
Mike- Sounds like you have something neat there! Daniel B. Wesson is best known as half of the Smith & Wesson firm famous for their cartridge revolvers. D.B. Wesson held numerous patents on revolvers, and had the privilege of being brother to Edwin Wesson and Franklin Wesson, also noted gun makers in the Connecticut River valley in the mid to late 19th century. Edwin worked in various places, and was in Hartford circa 1848-49, and died there in 1849. D.B. Wesson was the executor of Edwin's estate and continued rifle manufacture there for a while. Although there may be modest interest in the gun if it were made by someone else, its distant connection with Smith & Wesson would probably increase demand and value. We would need to see some photos to get a better idea of the condition and exact style. The missing false muzzle will hurt some. Just as a wild guess, it sounds like something I would see at a show priced in the $500-1,500 range, but possibly more depending on condition and quality. John Spangler


# 12187 - Winchester .22 Short Rifle With Military Marks
12/23/2006
Andy /Hartford/ CT

Winchester - .22 Short - Blue - 126776 AND 121644 -

U.S. [ordnance bomb] marked 126776 Any records on its SN? I have 2 of them. 126776 is U.S. marked, the other rifle isn't U.S. marked, its SN is 121644, its unusual feature is the factory original addition of a WRA Model 1873 type trap buttplate, with corresponding hole in the stock. Do you have any info on; 126776 [U.S. with bomb], or 121644? Thank you, Andy Gordon, in CT

Answer:
Andy- The Springfield Research Service database on our other site (http://www.armscollectors.com/srs.htm) for Winchester gallery practice rifles does not list either of these numbers. The 126,000 range is pretty heavily populated with rifles which were military property and are know to collectors as "Winder Muskets." These were pretty uniform in their features, and most seem to have been sold off as surplus in the late 1920s and 1930s. Your other rifle with a 121,000 serial number is at a point where not many military rifles are shown, so it was probably made for commercial sale. Winchester was very, very good about accommodating customer's desires on the Model 1885 single shots, so virtually any imaginable combination of features can be found. Bert Hartman, who answers a lot of questions on the Winchester forum at the ArmsCollectors.com site, is working on a book on these rifles, and would welcome your data on a survey form to assist in his research. John Spangler


# 11816 - Luger Value
12/23/2006
German

P.08 Luger - 9mm - 3 3/16'' - Blue - 4809 -

This handgun is the original bluing, with the eagle over the swastikas on several of the gun parts [barrel, top slide assy. and the top bolt action. It also has the number 41 just behind the barrel. On the knuckle assy. there are the letters byf in lower case. All the numbers on each gun part mach fully or at least have 09. the gun came with the black holster with spare clip and cleaning tool in it. Is there any real value to this gun and if so about how much.

Answer:
German, you did not provide any information about the most important factor that will determine the value of your Luger, condition. A rusty pitted Luger with all matching numbers that still retains the original bluing may only be worth about $300. A really nice byf 41 Luger with original holster may be worth up to $2500. Send me an e-mail if you want to sell, you can use the link on OldGuns.net. I will try to give you a more precise estimate of value. Marc


# 11813 - U.S. Issue Spanish Revolver?
12/19/2006
Michael

Thaue - .38 - 3 1/2 inches - chrome plated - 122207 -

Stamped on side plate above pistol grip the word'' Thaue or 7Kaue (stamped scroll emblem in circle)the word Mark'' at base of circle .''Spain'' stamped behind trigger guard., On barrel says'' Best American Cartridges Are Those That Fit Best in The O.H. Revolver Pat. 4 May 1881, 12 April 1888 or 1898, 27 May 1890, 11 June 1900, 26 July 1900, 23 May 1901''. On the ejector rod #'s 174. On base of barrel 174 or 175. #3 stamped on back face of cylinder. Looks to be chrome plated with gold plate on trigger, hammer, ejection piece to open cylinder, back face of cylinder and on grooves on cylinder. I would like to know history, Correct mfg and model, age of revolver if possible, was this used in military, what war, would this revolver be carried by an officer (or did plating come later by a possible gun enthusiast)was this revolver made in Spain and sold to U.S. military and approximate value in today's market. Thanks

Answer:
Michael, I can find no information in any of my reference books on this particular manufacturer. It sounds like you have one of the many Spanish Smith and Wesson copies which were imported into the United States in the first half of the 20th century. Spanish Smith and Wesson copies often had a logo that was similar to the one used by Smith and Wesson. One theory is that the similarity in logos was intentional, designed to deceive the unwary potential buyer into thinking that they were actually purchasing a real Smith and Wesson. These were often purchased by people who did not know much about guns or people who could not afford a real Smith and Wesson. They were NEVER sold to the U.S. Military. Although workmanship may be superb, Spanish Smith and Wesson copies have a reputation in general for making use of low quality, steel which may not be strong enough to handle modern day high- pressure loads. My advise would be to retire this weapon and not fire it. Values for these pistols are in the $50.00 range if you can find a buyer at all. Marc


# 11801 - byf Luger Date
12/19/2006
Bill, Houston, TX

Luger - P08 - 9mm - 4'' - Blue - 798? -

On the right hand side of the receiver it is marked with what appear to be two German imperial eagles and underneath each are the numerals 655. These are followed by a larger eagle with something in its feet. It is marked on the left with 798. It is marked byf on the end of the receiver. Can you date it.

Answer:
Bill, the eagles over "655" on your Luger are not imperial, they are Nazi. Eagle over 655 is a German WW-II Heerswaffenamt inspector's mark that was used on arms produced at Mauser Werke AG, Oberndorf am Neckar, Germany. The larger eagle sounds like a military test proof, the thing at it's feet should be a swastika in a circle. The byf marking is a WW-II German ordnance code that was assigned to Mauser-Werke, Oberndorf am Neckar, Germany. This code was used on P.08 (Luger) pistols in 1941 and 1942. Your Luger's chamber should be dated either "41" or "42". Let us know if you want to sell. Marc


# 12181 - Alcatraz Prison Marked Shotgun
12/19/2006
William, Chico, CA

Compeer Arms CO - 12 GA - 18 - Blue - 241595 -

On Right side of the stock: Alcatraz Fed. Prison with a small circle with inscription of a flying Eagle with three stars above it. Also on trigger guard attached is a bronze medallion with same inscription, plus Ser # and Tier 2 engraved I recently purchased this shotgun but not sure if it is army def. federal so most likely it is ,and did some research on the web but cannot find much about it except that compeer was purchased by crescent and then sold to ??? can you tell me a web site with more info and also of course what is the gun worth?? it is all in good to really good condition 90 % of bluing all take down parts fit tide, I shot the gun twice with low base shells and it works good quite a bit of recoil!! but accurate close up, all wood has no cracks ETC JUST REGULAR WEAR AND TEAR am I correct to think it is from around 1920??? thank you William V.

Answer:
I regret that I cannot provide any useful information. My gut feeling is that ALL "stage coach" or "prison guard" or other similar guns are fakes altered to deceive the unwary or uninformed buyer. There is a chance that it could be real. But the odds are about as likely as me winning the lotto and the Publishers Clearing House sweepstakes on the same day that an 18 year old buxom blonde nymphomaniac who inherited a rum distillery asks to marry me. You better be sure that the barrels are at least 18", and not a tiny bit under or that could mean legal problems for owning a sawed off shotgun.

I know that some federal prisons were using WW1 surplus riot guns (Winchester Model 97s or Remington Model 10s) in the 1920s, but I cannot say for sure that all did, or even most.

[Note- a follow up from William reported that he had seen the gun four years earlier and it was not for sale then. But, now it was for sale and the owner insisted that his father had been a guard at Alcatraz his whole life. My skepticism remains, as guards would end up on the wrong side of the bars if they started taking government guns home with them.] John Spangler


# 12177 - Cartridge Case Markings F 12 91
12/16/2006
Nelson L. Miller

Unknown - Cartridges - Unknown - Other -

this is a shell casing or cartridge question not a firearm....thanks I have several OLD what appear to be in size and shape to a 45 long colt black powder cartridges the marking on the shell case around the primer are F @ the 12 o'clock position 12 @ the 8 o'clock position and 91 @ the 4 o'clock position.......any ideas or another web site to visit for an answer

Answer:
Nelson- Your cases are indeed about the size of the .45 Long Colt, and are the military made cartridges for those pistols. From about 1875 to 1900 they usually used a three or four part headstamp marking. One letter indicated the place it was made/loaded with F for Frankford Arsenal, B for Bridgeport, L for Lowell, and W for Winchester. Sometimes a second letter was used such as R or C, especially on the .45-70 rifle load and the .45-55 carbine load which externally looked the same but had 70 or 55 grains powder charge, so it was important to distinguish between them. Another set of numbers reflected the month and date of manufacture. Most gun collectors like to have a couple of typical cartridges for display with their guns, although the really fanatical types will want to get one of every possible marking and load variation. Anyone interested in ammunition should check out the International Ammunition Association site at http://CartridgeCollectors.org for more about that field. John Spangler


# 12175 - USN Marked Trapdoor Bayonet Scabbard
12/16/2006
Denny, Malvern, Pa.

Scabbard,1873 Type? - Blue -

Hi John, I recently bought a foot locker full of assorted militaria at auction. Included was a scabbard that appears to be Span-Am type, leather frog with crimped on metal scabbard. The brass swivel disc is marked ''USN''. I thought it may be unusual. Marine? Navy? Thanks in advance for your time. I introduced myself at the Baltimore Show a few years back. I attended the show based on your recommendation and boy were you right! What a nice show. Thanks, Denny

Answer:
Denny- Good to hear from you again! Your scabbard is indeed one made for use by the U.S. Navy. These do not turn up very often, and they tend to sell for 50-100% more than a plain U.S. scabbard. In addition to trapdoors, they were also used with other socket bayonets in the same period, when the Navy had various rolling blocks, the Remington Lee and Winchester Hotchkiss rifles.

I recall that the USS Olympia was looking for some of these scabbards a while back. If you feel generous you might donate it to them. If you are looking for a nice local activity, go on down to Penn's Landing and visit the USS Olympia some time. One of the very few pre-WW1 ships left afloat anywhere in the world. See you at Baltimore! John Spangler


# 11788 - Radom Pistol
12/16/2006
Walter

F.B.Radom - 35 - 9mm - Blue - A46XX -

Slide Left F.B. Radom VIS Mod.35Pat.Nr.15567 (small markings after)&''P.35(p)'' with what looks like WaA77 on second line. Left Frame WaA77 also looks like a W on the trigger guard and a W on what I think is a stock guide Grips Left black diamond FB roghtVIS The pistol is in great shape sort of a purplish blue finish. I am looking to find just what it might be worth and other info on the pistol. It is also in a brown holster stamped in ink with''P35(P)''

Answer:
Walter, the Polish military adopted the VIS MOD. 35 (Radom) pistol in 1935 as their standard military sidearm. On September 1, 1939, Radom production was taken over by the invading Germans. When the takeover occurred, all Polish markings on Mod. 35 pistols were discontinued and a German numbering system was instituted. All Radom pistols manufactured after September of 1939 have German markings.

Collectors have categorized Mod. 35 pistols into 3 different types and several sub types. To avoid confusion I will try to stick to the three main types for this answer. Type I pistols were manufactured in the first part of the war, Type II towards the middle and Type III at the end.

On type I pistols, all parts except the recoil spring and recoil spring guide are blued with high quality commercial type blue finish. Barrel, recoil spring, and recoil spring guide are polished white. Grips are checkered hard rubber. A shoulder stock slot and a lanyard ring may or may not be present.

Type II pistols have all parts except the barrel, recoil spring, and recoil spring guide blued over an improperly polished surface. Barrel, recoil spring, and recoil spring guide are polished white. Grips are checkered black plastic, checkered brown plastic, fine checkered hardwood, or coarse checkered hardwood. Lanyard ring and disassembly lever are present, shoulder stock slot omitted.

The frame, slide, and magazine of type III pistols are parkerized. Rear sight, hammer, hammer release, magazine release catch, slide stop, and grip screws are blued over a roughly or poorly polished surface. Barrel, recoil spring, and recoil spring guide are polished white. Lanyard ring is present, shoulder stock slot and disassembly lever are absent. Grips are checkered black plastic, checkered brown plastic, fine checkered hardwood, coarse checkered hardwood, or grooved hardwood.

According to Jan C. Still's excellent book "Axis Pistols", your pistol's serial number puts it into the grade I late range (serial numbers A1000 to E8000). These pistols have a blued finish over a slightly less polished surface. Values for grade 1 pistols are in the $500 to $650 range. I recently purchased one for my collection for $500 from a friend.

German WWII Radom military holsters will be stamped on the inside of the of the flap with "P.35(p)", a maker code and a date. Values for German WWII Radom military holsters are in the $100 to $175 range depending on condition. Marc


# 11786 - 62 A Value
12/12/2006
Allen, Cataula, GA, USA

Winchester - Model 62A - 22 Rim Fire - Appx 22.5 inches - Blue - 100821 -

Inherited the gun from my dad who bought it about 1940. No interest in ever selling, but curious of the approximate value. The gun is in excellent shape and loads and fires like new. Thank you very much for your service.

Answer:
Allen, the 62A is a great design and for a while there was a lot of demand for them, values in the blue book go as high as $700 or more. It has been my experience that lately demand has dropped off a little. The last one that I had was in really nice condition, we sold it on sale for $450 after it had lingered in our catalog for too long. Marc


# 11780 -
12/12/2006
Matt Cypress Tex

Colt Police Positive Special - 32-20 - 4in - Blue - 164635 -

Good cond, would like to know date of manufacture and value

Answer:
Matt, your revolver was manufactured in 1919. Unfortunatly there is not much collector demand for this model and the caliber will only hurt. I often see Police Positive Specials in excellent condition offered in the $100 - $125 range at gunshows. Marc


# 12173 - Remington Derringer
12/12/2006
Liz, Las Vegas, NV

Remington Arms Co. Derringer - Don't Know - 459 -

Top of gun barrel is marked as follows: REMMINGTON ARMS CO. ILION N.Y. The gun barrel opens and the number ''459'' is stamped under the barrel. My husband's aging grandmother flew this gun from New York to Las Vegas in her possession (very pre 9/11) to give to us. She said her husband had purchased it for her for protection when he was away working on the railroad. It is a small Dilliger two barrel handgun with pearl handles. How do I determine its value? I've looked around online and I can't find a picture of any of them that closely resemble it other then some replicas that don't shoot and a belt buckle!

Answer:
Liz- We are glad that Granny didn't end up in the slammer hauling a gun around on an airplane. Since you noted that it has Remington markings, we are sure that it is an example of the "Remington Double Derringer." There were 150,000 of these made between 1866 and 1935, with more than half of them marked like yours, which is found on those made between 1888 and 1911. They used various numbers, not but not in any sort of sequence that allows us to date them. They used a rather puny .41 caliber short rimfire cartridge, but were well made and reliable, and powerful enough for short range self defense use. The weak point in the design is the small metal hinge where the barrels pivot upwards, and these are often found broken. Values for your variation are in the several hundred dollar range depending on condition. It sounds like a nice family keepsake, but I would get something newer that you can find ammo for if you want home defense weapon. John Spangler


# 12170 - Trapdoor Fencing Musket
12/9/2006
Mike Republic of Mass.

US Springfield - Fencing Musket? - N/A - 22 1/2 - Blue - 290187 -

I came upon what appeared to be a trap door Springfield at a yard sale. It looked at first to have been made into a wall hanger at some point in its life. Of course it was/is/may have been at some point a gun so I coughed up the five bucks and brought it home. In looking around on the web I see that it resembles a Springfield fencing musket. There are some questions though. My gun has an original trap door front sight. It also has a cleaning rod. The hammer is missing but the lever to operate the trap is still attached. The barrel is plugged. The butt plate is missing and the screw hole on top of the comb of the stock has been plugged. There is a rack number stamped below this hole. I can't figure out the purpose for this modification. There is no rear sight just the holes. The overall length is 42 1/2. Overall it is in good condition except for a coat of varnish that covers everything. So what do I have here? Is it a fencing musket or just a bar room decoration? Do you have any idea where I can get a butt plate and a front barrel band? Thanks for keeping a great web page!

Answer:
Mike- I am not sure what you found (but it sounds like a good deal anyway!), A Fencing musket will measure 43 inches overall for the type III or type IV, while the earlier ones were normal trapdoor rifle length. The Type III used a socket bayonet with the blade ground very thin, and fitted with a leather covering and a rounded tip so that it would bend during bayonet training, or sparring with other soldiers. These used a front sight/bayonet stud. The Type IV used a bayonet that was closer to a blade type and had two crossguard pieces and those were secured to the barrel with screws on the right side of the barrel. If not a fencing musket, it could be one of the trapdoors altered by Bannerman or other surplus firms and sold to various "Boys' Brigades" which were popular before the Boy Scout movement took hold. Also, many schools included military drill as part of the curriculum prior to WW1. As far as parts, I would try the good folks at S&S Firearms on our links page. John Spangler


# 12233 - Oklahoma Lawman Material
12/9/2006
Chuck

Two questions... My granddad left me a couple of guns...no history to speak of. He carried an old Colt .44-40 and a '92 carbine as a deputy U.S. Marshall at the turn of the century in Indian Territories. The first is a Winchester rifle, not a carbine, model 1892, chambered for .32.20. The second is a small pocket pistol, a birds grip small pocket pistol, 32 caliber, loads from the front of the cylinder, no ammunition, reportedly taken from Bill Doolin. Both weapons are NRA very good to excellent condition. Granddad left a trunk full of assorted weapons to me when he passed away. I'm not interested in selling them, but in those days when firearms were taken from criminals they were usually tossed into a box in the jail. Granddad was a deputy working in a small town in Oklahoma and left quite a collection of wanted posters and old weapons. Any idea as to value of these items...? Thank you for your assistance,

Answer:
Chuck- The guns alone have good collector interest and value without any history. Any history just adds to the interest. There is a lot of collector interest in old west stuff, old law enforcement stuff, outlaw stuff, etc, so the value of all this could be substantial. We really do not have a feel for the market value on those sorts of things (our niche is more the military type stuff) so we cannot do a very good job putting values on them. If you have some selected guns we can give you a ballpark idea on those (minus history) and you can figure another x% for the history.

Nice stuff. It is good to see some of it still in the family where it is appreciated.

Value and desirability will be enhanced with as much background on your Granddad as you can get- copies of photos, newspaper articles, "service record" (or similar employment history). I would also recommend having a notarized statement for each item (not a single document for everything, but a separate paper for each item listing make, model, serial number, or description of the poster (name, date, etc) so that each item can be definitely linked to its history connected to your Granddad and then to you by inheritance. Good luck. John Spangler


# 11778 - Wilkinson Webley Revolver
12/9/2006
Robert

Wilkinson Webley - 455 - Blue -

Right side, frame, under cylinder: flying bullet over ''W&S.'' Wilkinson Webley Model'' on top of barrel. ''Wilkinson Webley'' on frame above cylinder, left side.''456/455'', left side of frame in front of cylinder. ''England'' above. Right side, in front of cylinder, proof marks and ''NP''. Wooden grips with silver monogram. I've written to Wilkinson about the revolver; all records were lost in the London Blitz. At first glance, this is a Webley, but closer examination shows many differences: butt angle, hinge, sights, lanyard ring, lack of holster guards, etc. What have I got and what is it worth?

Answer:
Robert, Wilkinson supplied swords to officers and reasoned that when an officer bought a sword, it would be good business to sell him a revolver. The Wilkinson No.1 was manufactured in Belgium, later Wilkinson revolvers were manufactured in England by Webley. The 1st Model was .476 caliber, it was introduced in 1878, and had a 6.5 inch barrel that was rifled with five grooves. The 1st Model differed from the later Webley manufactured revolvers in the cylinder stops, to the rear of the cylinder, and in the design of the cylinder release. Most early Webley manufactured Wilkinson models were marked on the top of the barrel rib "WILKINSON & SON. PALLMALL.LONDON. Wilkinson's 'HW'" they also had a six-pointed star trademark either under the trigger guard or on the bottom of the butt. As time went on the differences between Wilkinson and Webley revolvers decreased until later Wilkinsons were selected Webley revolvers with a higher grade finish, Wilkinson markings and serial number.

Your revolver was probably sold for private purchase by officers possibly, for late African campaigns and/or the Boer War. I believe that we recently sold a Wilkinson that was in about 90% condition in the $1000 range. Marc


# 11765 - Mod 1890 Value
12/5/2006
Carolyn

Winchester - 1890 - 22 Short - 23 1/2 Octagon - Blue - 130XXX -

octagon barrel, pump , takedown model When was this made and in only fair condition, what is the value?

Answer:
Carolyn, my records indicate that your rifle was manufactured in 1902. Mod 1890 rifles made in 1901 and before have color case hardened frames, they are more rare and more valuable, in the $1500 to $4000 range. Since your rifle was manufactured in 1902 it should have a solid blue frame with no color case hardening. Values for Mod 1890 rifles that were made after 1901 range from about $500 to a little over $1000. Your rifle is in fair condition and it is chambered for .22 short only, both of these factors will hurt the value. I would expect to see a rifle like you describe sell at a gunshow in the $550 - $650 range. Marc


# 11764 - Early Marlin 1894
12/5/2006

Marlin - 1894 - 32 -

Metal has original Brown/Rust coloring Wood appears very old and is black in color with some chipping Metal shows no rust or pitting and appears to have natural wear Stock buttplate appears original to rifle and is curved (OLD ENGLISH STYLE?) Lever action works Top screw of tang and buttplate missing all others original Fair estimate of overall condition approximately 50 - 60 % When manufactured? Approximate value in 55% condition (due to natural wear of finish and stocks)?

Answer:
Mark, the Marlin 1894 was originally manufactured in .25-20 WCF, .32-20 WCF, .38-40 WCF, and .44-40 WCF calibers. Rifles came with a case colored receiver and blue barrel (the original color is not rust/brown), 10 shot tubular magazine, 24 inch round or octagon barrel and straight or pistol grip stock. Possibly your barrel is a custom length or it has been replaced. You should have a gunsmith verify caliber and check for safety before you try to fire it. The model was introduced in 1894 and discontinued in 1934, records indicate that your rifle, serial number 132815, was manufactured in 1895. Model 1894 values in the blue book for rifles in 50% condition are in the $800 to 1200 range. Marc


# 12232 - Converting A Rifle To .276 Pedersen Caliber
12/5/2006
Jack

I just bought two unopened boxes of ,276 Pederson ammo. If I converted a M1903 or a M1 Garand to this caliber. Would this interest a collector, or just be junk? I imagine that there are no originals around.

Answer:
Jack- Maybe if you had a couple of cases of the ammo it might be fun to convert a rifle to use it, but otherwise I think it is not a very good idea. The ammo has some collector value ($20-30 per box in my experience), but it is corrosive primed, and of doubtful reliability to shoot. After spending a bunch of money in a new barrel and probably custom chambering reamers, you will have several hundred dollars invested on top of the cost of your rifle that would appeal to only a tiny handful of eccentric gun enthusiasts but probably not at a price anywhere near what you have invested. It would not be junk, just a pretty bad waste of money in my opinion. John Spangler


# 12231 - Model 92 Winchester Used By John Wayne
12/2/2006

I have a model 92, 38wcf, lever action saddle gun with a unique, though undocumented history. It is one of the guns used by John Wayne when he was a contract actor at Fox Studios. The gun is stamped "FOX STUDIO". Would this be a collectible?

Answer:
Sir- IF you have documentation to show that exact rifle by serial number was used by John Wayne in a specific movie, then I think that would add considerable collector value. Just being documented as used in a move in which he appeared, even if he used the same model rifle, probably would add some value, but not a huge amount. Merely being a former studio gun adds little or no value, and most are pretty well worn and generally not very desirable among gun collectors. They may have more appeal to collectors interested in movie memorabilia, but we do not hang around with people like that or have any feel for their thoughts of pricing. This is just enough out of our market niche that I don't think we would be interested in handling it. John Spangler


# 12230 - Charles Daly Muzzle Loader
12/2/2006
Diane, Florida

I have a gun I would like to get information on that was given to me, I looked on your web site and could not find the information on it. Please email me the information and value of this gun as soon as you can. Below is the information engraved on the gun. Black Power Only, Made in Italy. Cal. 50 Muzzle Loader 188747, Made in Italy for Charles Daly by Investarm, Marcheno, Italy.

I have emailed Investarm, and I am faxing this also to you to see if you will be able to help. I am also interested in selling this gun at this time if you would know of any information I need for selling collectors gun, or getting in touch with gun collectors. I do know that this was specially made for Mr. Charles Daly in 1887, who invented the 45 caliber, and that Mr. Charles died from a heart attach in 1899. I appreciate any and all the help you might be able to give me.

Answer:
Diane- The markings on your gun indicate that it is a modern made replica, probably made since about 1970 when interest picked up in shooting replica blackpowder arms. There is very limited collector interest or value in these. While not familiar with the exact model you have, my guess is that it is worth less than a few hundred dollars, at best, and perhaps no more than $100.

The story about this being made for Mr. Daly and that he invented the .45 caliber is totally incorrect. You would do best selling it at a gun show in the area, or at a local gun shop. John Spangler


# 11762 - Frontier Six Shooter
12/2/2006
Tom, Monmouth, Illinois

Frontier - Six Shooter - .44 Magnum - 6 1/2 inch - Blue - 4/0925 -

I obtained this hand gun from my father who actually inherited it from his father. I would like to know anything and everything I can find out about the history and value of this hand gun. It is very clean and in good working condition with only one flaw, a line down the shell ejector from where my grandfather wore it on his side in a holster.

Answer:
Tom, I don't have much information on this revolver. There was a Frontier Six Shooter marketed by Cimarron Firearms. The blue book lists that the Cimarron Frontier Six Shooter was available in .22 LR, .22 Magnum, .357 Magnum, .38 Special, .38-40 WCF, .44 Special, .44-40 WCF, or .45 LC calibers but it does not list .44 Magnum. Possibly this is an oversight, it also lists 4.75, 5.5 and 7.5 inch barrel lengths for this model but it does not list a 6.5 inch barrel. Values for Cimarron Frontier Six Shooters are in the $150 to $250 range.

The name Frontier Six Shooter was also used on cheap West German import revolvers manufactured by Rohm. I have not been able to find if any Rohm revolvers were ever manufactured in .44 Magnum. If your revolver is a Rohm, value will be in the $50 range and I would advise against shooting it. Marc


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