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# 13404 - Shotgun Value

I recently purchased a Winchester model 1897 12 gauge shotgun and was just wondering what kind of value this shotgun has. It's in very good condition and fully functional. Your quick response is greatly appreciated. Thanks

Tony- Fair market value is whatever a willing buyer and seller agree on, so what you paid is what it is worth. You can check various dealers to find one in similar condition to see what they are asking, but better might be auction sites where an item has actually sold. Without seeing your gun we really cannot put an accurate value on it. John Spangler

# 13509 - American Historical Society Commemoratives
Rich Knowles, Claymont, De

Blue -

I inherited a commemorative collection of fire arms ''American Historical Society'' purchased during the 1980's. Pistols are in wooden cases and in excellent condition. Looking for an interested buyer.

Rich, it has bee my experience that most of the people who seem to have had any interest in American Historical Society Commemoratives purchased them when they were originally being offered. There is little or no collector interest on the secondary market. The last one that I marketed (for the estate of a friend) sold for one or two percent of the original purchase price after a long wait. Good Luck, Marc

# 13492 - Springfield 22 Parts
Keith, Zebulon, NC

Springfield - 1911 - 22 Short - Blue - 21807 -

Springfield 1911 patent June 2, 10908 I have a small 22 cal rifle. It is a stock fed, bolt action rifle. I'm looking for information and a new stock and trigger guard. Can you help?

Keith, I do not have a lot of information on this firearm, it is probably one of a huge number made in the late 19th and early 20th centuries and sold through various retail outlets. This type of firearm falls into the category of "old guns" that no one seems to be interested in as shooters, but collectors do not want them either. Generally these were basic inexpensive simple guns which sold at modest prices and still have little interest or value on market today. On the retail market they usually sell in the $25-125 range depending on condition and general appearance for use as a "wall hanger" over a fireplace. Where there is any family history, we encourage people to keep these old guns for sentimental value. Please be warned that many of these are not considered safe to shoot.

For parts the best place to check is Gun Parts Corp (the old Numrich Arms people) at the following URL:

Gun Parts Corp has just about everything. If that doesn't work, try posting it on our free "Wanted" page. Marc

# 13485 - FIE Texas Ranger For Home Protection?
Amy B Grand Prairie, Texas

FIE - Texas Ranger Model Tx-22 - 22 - Long - Don't Know - TX46512 -

?? I am a girl, what the heck, it is a revolver with a dark metal finish and wood grips....Is that enough? lol This gun was given to me in the early 90's by my grandfather who has since passed. I have the original box, paperwork, receipts and price tags. It has only been fired maybe one time. Is this gun something I should keep for home protection? I am not a real fan of revolvers but it is all I have, I have been around guns all my life but rifles, semi-auto. Is there any value to this piece, if so, I may try to trade at the next gun show here in Fort Worth??? Thanks for your help, I can't find anything on the internet..

Amy, your description is fine, I often see Texas Ranger revolvers like yours selling in the $100 - $125 range at gunshows. For home protection many people think that a revolver is a better choice than a semi auto because revolvers are usually more reliable. My personal choice is a pump shotgun. I like the Mossberg 500 because I have found them to be inexpensive and reliable. Marc

# 13399 - Stevens “Second Quality”

I have a J Stevens Tool & Company model 235 shotgun with lockback hammers. On the bottom of the gun where the model number is the word “second” is stamped in two placed. I have spoke to several gun shops and know one has seen second stamped on these guns. I was trying to find out if the company stamped these when it was produced because there was a fault in it and what the value would be. Thanks for your time.

It was common for gun makers to gather up guns with slight defects (usually cosmetic) and then mark then as "second" and sell them at reduced prices. There is little real interest in Stevens guns to start with, but if you can find someone who collects them, they would probably pay a modest premium for this one, especially if in excellent condition. If in fair to poor condition, then it may bring little extra, and basic value would be minimal anyway, perhaps as little as $100-150. Hope that helps. John Spangler

# 13395 - Marlin Rifle With Strange Markings

Marlin - 30-30 -

I have an old Marlin 30-30 with a very low serial number and a unique stamp on the buttstock. It is stamped "BWF-156-10". I have no idea what this means but I imagine it is some type of military marking for keeping track of the gun. I got the gun from my father who got it from an uncle who got it from....and so on and so on so I know it's fairly old. Could you please tell me something about it? I'd really appreciate it. Thanks

Sorry, we cannot help with that one. Marlin serial numbers are a confusing subject we cannot unravel.

The BWF-56-10 does not sound like military markings, and I do not know of any military use of Marlin .30-30s (a few Winchesters were used to guard spruce tree operations during WW1 in the Pacific northwest.) I suspect it refers to some sort of Police Department or Prison, or Department of Fish & Wildlife agency, or some sportsman's group or hunting lodge that had a large number of "loaners."

Probably a good shooter with a nice family history, but collector value is probably modest. Hope that helps. John Spangler

# 13493 - 1934 Beretta Value.

Beretta - Cal.9Corto Mo1934 Brevettato Gardone 9mm - 3 1/2'' - Blue - 766286 -

Accompanying this pistol are a leather holster and 20 rounds of ammunition. The bullets have various markings, some illegible, some GFL 1933-39. What might the value of these items be?

Dave - condition is a ,major factor when determining the value of a fierarm. You did not mention the condition the pistol is in so I can only give you a rough estimate. Value is in the $200 to $600 range. Marc

# 13496 - Original or a Replica?
Don Columbia, MO

1851 - Navy - 36 - 7 1/2 - Blue - 28557 -

has xx9 above trigger guard. beside it it says pn with a star above it. Does say made in Italy on the barrel. It is brass around the hammer and down to the trigger guard. Is it an original or a replica?

Don, rule of thumb. If there is a mark anywhere on a pistol that looks like an old Colt that says ``Italy``, it is a replica. Marc

# 13487 - Winchester .22 Rifle Identification

Winchester - Unknown - .22 Short/long/long Rifle - Approximately 18'' -

My father had a .22 Winchester bolt action rifle, with a short action and a tubular magazine under the barrel. The sights were open with the rear sight adjusted for elevation with a stepped slide under the sight. The sight was made with a slotted spring steel leaf that was drifted into a slot forward of rear sight. The front sight was beaded post drifted into a slot. The magazine held approximately 15 to 17 long rifles. I would guess it was made in the 30s or 40s. I am looking for the model number for the rifle. Can you tell what it might be?

Vance, I am pretty sure that the rifle that you are asking about is a Winchester Model 72. The Model 72 Repeating Rifle was Winchester's first bolt action rifle equipped with a tubular magazine and chambered for rim fire cartridges. Winchester introduced the Model 72 to compete with similar designs being offered by other firearms manufactures that were very popular at the time. Factory records indicate the first delivery of Model 72 rifles was made on April 18, 1938. The Model 72 was designed to chamber 22 Short, 22 Long, and 22 Long Rifle, cartridges interchangeably. The stock was plain walnut with a semi-beaver tail, pistol grip. Weight was about 5 & 3/4 pounds. As an alternative to open or peep rear sights, Model 72 rifles could be ordered with scope bases attached to the barrel for use with Winchester 2 & 3/4-power or 5-power telescopic sights. Rifles furnished with telescopic sights could be ordered with or without standard iron sights attached. These rifles were not shipped from the factory with the scope attached to the barrel, scopes were packed separately in the same carton with the rifle. Production of the Model 72 was discontinued in 1959 after about 161,412 rifles had been manufactured. Marc

# 13378 - Liverpool Ohio Gun Maker Information

Liverpool ( ? ) Ohio - Long Gun - Unknown Various ( ? ) - Long Gun - Don't Know - UNKNOWN -

Unknown About 1970 I met a man from north east Ohio who claimed to own an old handcrafted rifle which he claimed he had in his possession - but which I never personally saw - because life intrudes when you are young and have kids to raise. He claimed that the gunsmith who built the gun lived and worked at his home a long time ago near the intersection of what is now Grafton Eastern Road and Earhart Northern Roads in north west Liverpool Township in north west Medina County Ohio in the area now known as Valley City, ZIP 44280. The Valley City bicentennial is coming up soon and I am just beginning trying to research anything I can learn about such a gun maker, his shop, and the rifles he may have made. The era of interest is potentially between 1810 and perhaps into the late 1800's. Living nearby, when I drive in the area I try to imagine what site or buildings may have been involved - but am unable to achieve any clear historical insight based upon the physical geography I see today. Any information which anyone can offer is appreciated. Thanks Peter Stroth at

Peter- I do not know much about Ohio makers, but there are two excellent resources nearby who may be able to help.

a. Macy Hallock who lives in Medina knows quite a lot about Ohio rifles, and may be able to help you. I don’t have an address, but he is connected with the real estate outfit there with his name, although his sons may be running it now and would know how to contact him. Tell Macy that John Spangler sent you.
b. Just down the road in Lodi, the Kindigs at the Log Cabin gun shop are experts in all sorts of rifles like that and may know others with even more knowledge about Ohio made rifles. It is well worth the time to run down to visit their shop, and about half of it is a museum dedicated to muzzle loading rifles. They are great people and I am sure would be helpful with your quest.

John Spangler-

# 13375 - USMC Rifle Carrying Case
Chris Charlotte, NC

USMC Rifle Case - Blue -

Canvas and leather USMC Rifle bag/case embossed EGA on the leather end cap markings stenciled 4x on the sides RRDET MCB CLNC I recently found this case/bag at a surplus store it was in a rather out of the way place and I was able to purchase it for a very cheap price. Can anyone tell me what the approximate age of this might be? I have deduced that the stencil is ''Rifle Range Detachment, Marine Corps Base, Camp Lejeune North Carolina. It is in fair condition, canvas with leather trim and leather straps, and appears 100% original. The inside has a fair amount of what I would assume is ''sight black'' which might indicate that it was used by a member of the rifle team. Any information you can provide would be greatly appreciated!

Chris- I am afraid you know as much as we do about this one. I agree with your analysis. I cannot help with the value, but I am sure that some fanatical Marine Corps collector would think it is neat, although condition may keep the value and demand rather modest. John Spangler

# 13454 - FIE Cowboy

F. I. E. - Cowboy - .22 - 5.5 - Nickel - TR41238 -

F.I.E. I have a ''cowboy'' model revolver that only has the F.I.E. Miami, Fl stamped on it. I would like to find the real manufacturer, history and the value. I paid $100 about 14 years ago.

Brian, FIE stands for Firearms Import Export company, they operated out of Hialeah, Florida from about 1980 until 1990 when they declared bankruptcy. Blue book values for most FIE single action revolvers are a little less than what you paid, in the $25 to $75 range depending on condition. The blue book indicates that the FIE Cowboy model was US made but that is all that I was able to find out about the manufacturer. Marc

# 13455 - Clement Automatic 25
Julie, Sherman Oaks, Ca

Clement - Pistol - .25 - 4 Or 5 Inches - Don't Know - 21280 -

Automatic Pistol Clement's listed on top of the barrel. I would like to know about the history of this gun and if it would be considered valuable and, or a relic. Thank you.

Julie, Charles Ph. Clement of Liege Belgium first patented an ingenious blowback pistol design with a fixed barrel and moving bolt in 1903. The original design had a barrel and return spring that were concealed in a fixed housing attached by two screws that engaged a pillar formed by the rear end of the frame. The bolt was slightly offset to clear the pillar and it recoiled backward out of the housing. Improvements were made to the Clement design in 1903, 1907 and 1910. In 1912 Clement gave up on the patented design and they started producing a Browning copy 1906-type pistol. It is speculated that Clement may have either retired or died by this time. The Clement company did not survive the German occupation of Liege in WWI and no pistols were manufactured after 1914.

There is not allot of collector interest in this type of pistol, I would expect to see one offered for sale at a gunshow in the $150 range. Marc

# 13275 - Spencer Rifles Used By 17th Indiana

Spencer - Carbine - 52 - 22 - Blue - XXXXXX -

Where can I find serial numbers for Spencer rifles purchased by 17th Indiana Company in 1862?

Frank- As far as I know there is no source for that information. John Spangler

# 13336 - 1926 Pen Gun

I have a pen gun that from what I understand was patented in 1926. The fellow that I got it from swears that it shoots a .38 call. I would like to know if there is a way I can find out the proper information on it before I go and blow my hand off. Its patent number is 1,772,656. All I have been able to find out of that is when it was made. There is no information on cartridge size. The.38 seems to be too large to fire correctly. On a .38 caliber gun the bullet goes in the barrel to a degree but on this gun is stops about halfway. The .38 does load into the gun but that’s a lot of power to be shooting in something your unsure of. I you could please let me know if ya'll know anything better.

Hugh- Bad news for you. Unless that is already registered with BATF it is contraband and can only get you in serious trouble. They consider these to be the same as a sawed off shotgun, and cannot be owned or transferred without a special permit from BATF.

You should call them and arrange to turn it in for destruction. Or, if you think they should be out taking guns away from drug dealers and the like instead of worrying about stuff like this, you may want to just get rid of it on your own and not bother them. .

I suspect that yours was chambered for a very weak .38 S&W cartridge loaded with black powder to fire a tear gas charge, not any of the higher pressure loads with a real bullet, and certainly not any modern loads. It would be unsafe to shoot with ANY ammo as far as I am concerned. Hope that helps. John Spangler

# 13452 - Colt Copy Revolver
Lattie Hester Angier, NC

Colt - Unsure - 45/Black Powder - 6'' - Blue - 67858 -

Has Connecticut Valley Armed Inc. Along with battleships with sails ,flags flying and also engraved on the cylinder ''Engraved by Wm.Putney New York.'' ENGAGED May 16, 1843 was at the top of the cylinder. CVA is on the side of the handle .On the bottom of the barrel is A.S.M.Black Powder Only Made in Italy. Colt Pat # is on the cylinder but there was no number. The #'s 67858 are on the end of the frame. I'm confused as to when Colt put out this particular gun and its value. The grip is a warm oakwood and the engraved battleship scenes are very detailed. Any info?

Lattie - sorry to be the bearer of bad news but Colt did not manufacture this revolver. It is a modern copy manufactured in Italy. I would expect to see something like this sell at a gunshow in the $100 to $150 range. Marc

# 13449 - Deutsche Reichspost PPK
Jack, Hoover, Alabama

Walther - PPK - 7.65 - Nickel - 954549 -

Initials DRP engraved in left side of frame opposite of where serial number is on right side of frame. Just wondering the approximate manufacturing date and value range. It has the Crown over N proof under the ejection port. Has lanyard slot on bottom. My uncle brought this one back from WWII. Supposedly taken off dead German officer whom it belonged to. The initials matched his ID, (again supposedly).

Jack, Crown over N proofs appear on pre- 1940 production Walther PPK pistols. The DRP markings that you are asking about are found on pistols that were manufactured for the Deutsche Reichspost (German Postal Service). Known examples of DRP marked German Post Office PPK pistols are found in the 912330-955817 serial number range.

Deutsche Reichspost pistols are very scarce but the finish should be blue. If your pistol is nickel plated, it has been re-finished and most of the collector value is gone. Sorry - Marc

# 13323 - Chemical Warfare Items
Tonia, Bartlesville, OK

Ammo - Blue -

Property of School of Chemical Warfare, Edgewood Arsenal, MD. No. 64 My first question is: Does my question have to be about a firearm? I have a cloth drawstring sack that is about 6'' x 10'' that has ''Property of School of Chemical Warfare, Edgewood Arsenal, MD. No. 64'' printed on it. Inside the bag there are seven bullet shaped objects with blunt, sort of squared off tips, that are made out of a stiff wax-like substance. The ''bullets'' are about 3'' long each, and about 1.25'' across. I would like to find out what these are, so my second question is: Do you have any idea what is in the bag, or do you know somewhere might find out. Thank you, and you have a very interesting site.

Tonia- The school of Chemical Warfare dealt with training troops to handle and fire chemical warfare agents (many now banned by treaty) including mustard gas, nerve gas, smoke, etc. They also taught soldiers how to react to attacks by such agents and to decontaminate themselves and their equipment and return to combat. My guess is that this is some sort of training kit with various samples. It may have different scents in each of the items as some chemical agents have distinctive odors, or it may be something else entirely. In any case, I get real nervous messing with stuff I don’t know anything about, and I would not handle these much, and would wash thoroughly afterwards. I doubt if they are very dangerous, but since I don’t know I would not mess with them at all. Your best bet might be to see if there is an Army museum specializing in Chemical Warfare and to email them some pictures. Hope that helps. John Spangler

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