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# 485 - Lefever 12 Gauge Shotgun
3/31/97
Merv mervw2oe@aol.com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Lefever Double Barrel Shotgun 12 Gauge 30 Inches, Damascus Blue 44XXX H

1. What is the approximate age of the gun? 2. What is the approximate value of the gun? 3. The shell ejector mechanism was lost and replaced by a hand made one. Can you suggest where I might find an original replacement?

Answer:
Merv, The Lefever was the first commercially successful hammerless double barrel shotgun made in America. They were made in Syracuse, NY from 1885-1916, at which time the company was acquired by Ithaca Gun Company. Ithaca made the Lefever until 1916. In 1921 the Box Lock Nitro Special was introduced and in 1934 the Lefever Grade A was introduced. Production of Lefever guns ceased in 1948. To find a replacement ejector go to our links page and follow the gun parts links. Values for Lefever shotguns range from $200 to over $30,000 depending upon grade and condition. for instructions on how to get an appraisal go to our appraisals page, good luck... Marc


# 463 - Shotgun-.44XL
3/31/97
Barry Bsenseman@aol.com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Unknown Unknown 44 cal. 22 1/2 appox. Unknown possibly 48xcx

On top of barrel...X.L. Shot-gun 44cal. c. f. pat'd June 23,1885On butt plate, stock front grip, and trigger guard I have found the number 4831 (not always completely legible) stamped in with the exception of the stock (in pencil).

Anything you can tell would be appreciated. is X.L Shot-gun manufacturer , a type of shot-gun or both. is it a shot-gun or a 44 cal rifle bore is dirty but seems not to have riffling thanks.

Answer:
Barry- "XL" was a trade name used by Hopkins & Allen on rifles, pistols and shotguns. (Pronounced as "Excel" as in "really good!") The cartridge it used is known as the .44XL shot cartridge. While it was similar to the .44-40 (and they may even fit into guns chambered for the other) they are not considered interchangeable, and would be unsafe to shoot in a gun not specifically chambered for the cartridge in question. Inexpensive shotguns were hand items, popular for shooting pests (rats and stuff, not the neighbors) in the mostly rural areas in the 1880-1910 period... John


# 461 - Excam Armi F.lli Tanfoglio E-15
3/31/97
Rick

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Armi F.lli Tanfoglio - Brescia Italy E-15 .22 L.R. 4" Blue 48XXX

Excam Inc., Hialeah Fla.AA PSF

What is the history of this weapon and does the company sill exist?

Answer:
Rick, Excam of Hialeah Florida, went out of business in 1990, they were an importer and distributor of mostly inexpensive firearms. I can find no references to the model E-15 or Armi F.lli Tanfoglio. There is a Tanfoglio located in Gardone Italy who manufactures good quality semi-automatic and single action handguns... Marc


# 450 - Shotgun- American Gun Company
3/31/97
J.D. McQueen JDMcQ01

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
American Gun Co. Double-barrel 12 Gauge 32 Inch Blue 332XXX

Made in New York

I would like to know and information you have regarding this firearm and also it's present value. Thank you very much.

Answer:
JD- American Gun Company was a trade name used by H&D Folsom & Co. for shotguns (most likely imported ones at that!). Collector interest is very low, as was the initial quality, and values are in the $50-150 wall hanger category... John


# 448 - English Revolver- W.L. Gordon, Sunderland
3/31/97
Bob

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Unknown Unknown About 41 Unknown Unknown Unknown

I have a circa 1860 English double action, six shot (about 41 caliber) pistol marked on top of barrel "W. L. Gordon Sunderlund." It has common factory engraving, loading lever, no spur on the hammer, black checkered grips. The English markings, as near as I can tell, are very small and only on the cylinder. My question is whether there is any evidence that this pistol was imported into the US during the civil war; it has characteristics of Deane, Adams, Kerr. Thanks for any help you can give me. Bob Tosterud

Answer:
Bob- You should be glad we know a little about guns, but unhappy that we don't know much about English geography. Sunderland is located in Durham County (somewhere about 5000 miles east of here). William Lister Gordan operated at 29 East Cross Street, Bishop Warmouth, in 1854 and at 137 High Street 1855-59. With a dealers marking somewhere in the UK, it was probably sold for domestic use, not export. However, US and Confederate agents were scouring the countryside throughout Europe and the British isles buying arms. This particular style handgun was not high on their list, but a few Adams/Tranter/Kerr pistols were known to have seen military use, but many more were privately purchased by US and CS citizens and soldiers. Perhaps the best indication of possible Civil War use would be the background ("provenance" in the museum trade) that is known about it. I would bet that it got here in recent years, not 1861-65, but could be wrong. Hope this helps... John Spangler


# 436 - WAMO .22 Caliber Cartridge Pistol
3/31/97
Mike

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Wamo Powermaster Target .22 S,L,LR 3" + - Blue/black 002XXX

I picked this "wonder" up at a gun show in San Antonio several years ago. I have asked all the "experts" in Houston, San Antonio, Dallas and Ft. Worth NO ONE seems to know anything about this pistol. I have called the Wamo Corp. and was told by the person who answered the phone that, "I have been with the company for 25 years and we have NEVER made a cartridge pistol!: It is obvious by the condition of the box and the style of the printing that this pistol was made sometime in the late 40's or through the 50's which rules out the employee with 25 years at Wamo knowing anything about said gun. It is in approximately 90%+ condition as the only wear is from being in the box and the gun rubbing against the cardboard.

My question is do you or any one that you might know have any information regarding this pistol? I'm sure this is NOT the million dollar home run we all wish we could hit, however, it would be nice to know just what I have here. thank you for your time and attention. Mike Fritz

Answer:
Mike- WHAM!!! Just smack us up long side the head. We don't know nothing about this one either. You might try diggin into some old Gun Digests or Shooters Bibles to see if they list anything as being introduced. Or, it could have been some sort of prototype made for a trade show to see if there would be any interest in such a thing... John


# 431 - Perin Or Pering Mfg Co. Rifle
3/31/97
Steve

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Perin Ga MFG CO Or Pering MFG CO Unknown 30 To 34 36.5 Inches Unknown known

Perin GA Mfg Co or Pering Mfg Co on side plate. This is a percussion muzzle loader. overall length 52 " cheek rest on stock hexagonal barrel. Dual trigger, trigger guard, butt plate and ferrells look like brass. Trigger guard has diamond shaped inlay with decorative engraving which could be silver. Engraving on barrel end and on side plate. Looks a lot like a J.P Murray (Columbus ga) sharpshooters rifle (stock and barrel look the sme in side view

I am looking for any information on the gun or manufacturer. Local libraries don't mention the name on side plate.

Answer:
Steve- Perin and Gaff Manufacturing Company operated in Cincinnati, Ohio from 1861-1884. They were importers and dealers, so almost anything could show up with their markings. Most sporting rifles of the period look very similar, with octagon barrels and half stocks, and lots had double set triggers. Yours is a relatively small bore, suitable for squirrels, rabbits, and other dog and cat size critters. The sharpshooter rifles of the Civil War era were usually more like .42-50 caliber, and had heavier barrels. Civil War era gun- certainly, but probably not one used in combat. Hope this helps... John Spangler


# 457 - Model 1897 Winchester Shotgun
3/29/97
Perry

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester Model 1897 12 Gauge 25" Nickel(?) 356XXX

I would like to know the history of the gun and its value.

Answer:
Perry , your Model 1897 Winchester shotgun (serial number 356XXX) was manufactured in 1908. Approximately 1,024,700 Model 1897 shotguns were produced by Winchester from 1897 to 1957. The Model 1897 was an improvement of the model 1893 which was designed by John Browning. Winchester offered the Model 1897 in 12 or 16 gauge, with 26- 32 inch barrels and a plain pistol grip stock. A standard Model 1897 would be worth from $125 to about $400 depending upon condition. Special models can be worth over $3000.00 depending upon rarity and condition. My books do not list any Model 1897's that came from the factory with nickel plating, if your shotgun's nickel plating is not original the value would be reduced by 50 percent or more... Marc


# 466 - Early Mauser "Anti-tank Rifle"
3/29/97
Ron

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser Unknown 50? Unknown Unknown Unknown

First of all let me tell you I know nothing about guns which will soon become very evident. I have recently come into possession of a rifle. It has very little markings on it. It is a very large piece. It has the Mauser insignia, with a 1918 date below the insignia. It will probably Weigh about 75 lb. , and has a tripod plate on the forearm. This gun , to Me , appears to be about a 50 caliber., And it is a bolt action. Can you Shed any light on the original use of this type of firearm, I imagine That it is a military design, possible use as an early type of firearm Used to disable early model tanks that had minimal armor plating. Is This a collectible ? Does it have any significant value. Thank you for Any information you can forward me. Ron

Answer:
Ron, You know a lot more about these than you might think! Your rifle is indeed an early "anti-tank rifle" made by Mauser in 1918. These are familiar to many collectors, but not too many of them around. Many have been converted to fire US .50 cal Browning Machine Gun ammo over the years, so it is hard to be sure what caliber yours is in. World War I and Mauser collectors like these and are willing to pay pretty good money for them. Since it sounds like you are missing the heavy duty metal bipod that attached to the front of the stock, and we are not sure what the caliber is, and you don't state the condition, we cannot put a precise value on it. I would guess somewhere in the $1500-2000 range retail... John


# 455 - 1917 Enfield
3/29/97
Ed

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Eddystone 1917 30:06 26" Blue 736XXX

A crown with the letters BM on the receiver and bolt handle.

Since when does an American made 30:06 rifle have British Proof Marks? I'm confused? Any historical background on this gun would be greatly appreciated!

Answer:
Ed- Simpler than you think. The Brits proof stuff when it is made, and also guns that are exported from England. Huge quantities of US rifles (including M1917s and M1 Garands) were given to the British Government as "lend lease" material during WW2. When declared obsolete and sold off in the 1950s and 60s, these all had to be proof tested and marked before being shipped out of the country. Sorry we don't have any exciting history on your rifle. Maybe you should have bought the stuffed deer head I saw at a show in Delaware; it came with five different stories to tell your friends about how you got it... John Spangler


# 454 - Nickel S/42 Luger
3/29/97
Jerry

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser Luger S/42 9 Mm 4 Inch Nickel 14XX

14XX appears on most of the parts of the gun. 8.82 stamped under the barrel, p.08 on the left side of the receiver, Three possibly eagles? worn off, on the right side of the barrel. Receiver shows serial # 20 on it

What is the possible date of manufacture? Was this gun unusual or rare? Any estimated value?

Answer:
Jerry, S/42 was the WW-II German ordnance code assigned to Mauser-Werke AG, Oberndorff am Neckar, Germany. Lugers stamped with the S/42 code were manufactured between 1934 and 1940. The 8.82 stamping under your barrel is the bore size in millimeters and the eagles are military acceptance stamps. The S/42 Luger is one of the most common of Luger variations. An S/42 Luger in 90 percent condition is worth from $500 to $600 dollars. From your description it sounds like your Luger has been nickel plated and it's serial numbers do not match. I would estimate your Luger's value to be in the $200 dollar range... Marc


# 453 - Star Model B CONTINJADORA DE * EIBAR
3/29/97
Victor, EODVic@prodigy.net

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Star Model B 9x19 5 Inches Blue 2377XX

On theright side of slide: "STAR-SA. CONTINJADORA DE * EIBAR" B.ECHEVARRIA ESPANA Next to that it has: CAL 9m/m, Behind the serrations on the right side it has a bomb with a P, inside of it. In front of the sliderelease it has a "N" and what looks like a "coat of arms with an "x"inside the shield, it also has another "bomb with a P inside" wherethe trigger guard meets the frame. I have some information on the Star model Bs, but I have never seen one with "continjadora de EIBAR" stamped on it. Can you tell me what it means?, When was this pistol made?, thanks in advance

Answer:
Star began operation in about 1908 as Echeverria SA, Eibar. Although the name 'Star' was used from the first, it was not actually registered as the company trade mark until late in 1919, at which time, the name of Bonifacio Echeverria enters the picture as patentee and company director. In the early 1920s, the original pattern of 'Star' pistol, with open topped slide, was augmented by a new model with an all enclosing slide, based on the Colt M1911; this appeared in various patterns, including several with selective fire capability. During the Civil War, the factory suffered damage and the company records were destroyed by fire. After the war, the company was one of the three permitted to continue with pistol manufacture, and at the present time their products have a high reputation for quality and reliability. The list of models produced by Echeverria under the `Star' name is long, involved, and confusing. The early models were known by year designations, but in the 1920s the practice arose of giving each model a letter designation, which was later complicated by adding suffix letters to indicate minor changes. The Star Model B appeared after 1926 probably in 1928, it had a backstrap humped in the manner of the Colt M1911A1, a slide shaped like that of the Colt 1911A1, with vertical serrations at the rear end for finger grips, and a Colt type safety catch on the left rear of the frame. The rear sight was mounted in a rounded slot in the slide and acted as a firing pin retainer, and the hammer had a good sized spur on it. The "bomb P" stampings that you mentioned are Eibar proof marks in use since 1929. Now that I have tried to dazzle you with all of the preceding facts and information, I have to admit that I don't know exactly why CONTINJADORA DE * EIBAR is stamped on your Model B and not on others. I consulted a Spanish speaking friend and he said that CONTINJADORA DE * EIBAR is probably the name of the particular factory where your Model B was manufactured. If any of our readers know why CONTINJADORA DE * EIBAR is stamped on this Model B, I hope that they will let us know, I will post any answers that I receive... Marc


# 451 - Spanish Mauser Fr8 Rifle Safety
3/25/97
Bruce

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Spanish Mauser - La Coruna 1950 M43 Converted To FR8 7.62 NATO About 18" Parkerized 11XXX

FABRICA DE ARMES around a crest with LA CORUNA below and 1950 below - on the receiverFR8 - 11676 on the left side of the receiver (by the bolt)11676 on the top of the bolt handle A cross at the base of the bolt handle (top) - the four ends are elongated diamond shapedCAL.7.62 on the right side of the receiver A small cross within a circle on the right side front of the trigger guard (similar to the cross on the bolt handle)C.A.I. ST. ALB. VT ON THE BOTTOM OF THE BARREL NEAR THE FLASH HIDERFR8 SPAIN on the barrel below the above

I have been searching for information on this rifle. I have received two responses saying that the FR8 is based on the 8mm Spanish Mauser M43 and is very safe for normal 7.62x51 ammunition. I received one response saying that the FR8 is unsafe and inferior to the Guardia Civil and the FR7 which are both 7.62 NATO conversions from the Spanish 1916 Mauser in 7mm.This third response cites articles in the "American Survival Guide" and "Guns and Ammo" that criticized the FR8 and stated that the conversions based on the 1916 were safe and better than the FR8. Logic tells me that the first two sources are more reliable since the M43 is essentially a K98 designed to handle the higher pressure 8mm round vs the 7mm round of the 1916 rifle. Also the M43 has three locking lugs vs two on the 1916. I have not read either of the articles mentioned, and I have not found ANY published information on the FR*. Do you have any information on the FR8 or know of any sources. Thank you. Bruce Sharer

Answer:
Bruce- I am pretty ignorant about these, but they have a reputation as being real dogs and slow selling items from the dealers I have talked to. Even if I knew anything about their relative safety, I wouldn't tell you. (Go ask the lawyers, they seem to know more then anyone else, especially after something goes wrong.) I heard or dreamed, or read somewhere that the FR8s were mostly to give recruits something to drill with that approximated the looks/weight of more modern arms, and doubt if they were intended for much firing. As for me, I (a) would never want to own one and (b) darn sure never try to shoot one. You may get a second opinion from the folks that hang out on the Century Arms page (see our links). Hope this helps a little... John & Marc


# 449 - Mauser 98 Preduzece 44
3/25/97
Ed

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser K98 8MM Mauser 23" Blue K87XX

A crest on top of the receiver: a flame, a star, a banner with dates. PREDUZECE 44 on the side on the receiver.

I recently purchased a Mauser K98 in very good condition at a gun show. When I disassembled it to clean and check the gun I found it was encased with brown grease. What do I have? Can you tell me some of the history of this gun?

Answer:
Ed- I am pretty sure your Mauser was originally built for the German military prior to or during WW2, and later overhauled, refinished and remarked by the Yugoslavians. They were probably secondary issue arms after the Mosin Nagants and AK-47s which were more or less standard among all Communist bloc countries. Lately you have probably seen a few in the hands of the various ex-Yugoslavians who have renewed their centuries of attempts to annihilate each other in Bosnia, Serbia, coratia, etc. Somehow I fail to understand why some US troops living in between these guys for a few months or years will cause them to suddenly decide to get along with each other. Anyway, there have been a lot of these rifles on the surplus market in recent years... John


# 443 - Colt Ace
3/25/97
Mike

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt Ace 22 Long Rifle Unknown Unknown 19XX

My friend inherited this gun from the death of a relative. He is wondering if it is one of a batch of guns manufactured for the military and only issued to servicemen meeting 3 criteria.*I* don't have an abundance of information on this gun but he gave me the basic facts and asked me to check into it's value on the net. He thinks it may have been made in 1931.

Answer:
Mike, according to my records your friend's Colt Ace was manufactured in 1931 which was the first year that the Ace was offered for sale to the general public. Aprox. 11,000 Ace pistols were sold by Colt between 1931 and 1941 when manufacture was discontinued. The Colt Ace was designed to be a companion for the Government Model .45 Automatic Pistol that would be economical to shoot because it chambered in .22LR. The Ace is almost identical to the Colt Government Model except it has an improved adjustable rear sight and the front sight is higher than the Government Model's. The Ace's slide is externally the same as the Government Model's slide, but it is lightened by extensive internal machining and reduction of wall thickness so that the Ace would be able to function with .22LR ammunition which has a much lighter recoil that the .45 ACP cartridge does. Despite all of the effort that Colt put into lightening the slide, the Ace did not give smooth positive performance due to the fact that the .22LR cartridge does not have sufficient blowback strength to operate it's heavy slide. Colt sold approx.. 206 Ace pistols to the US Army between 1931 and 1936 starting with an order for 13 pistols in 1931. Sorry but I do not have any records that show which Ace serial numbers were delivered to the US Army. The Ace's reliability problem was solved by a firearms designer who did not work for Colt named David Williams. Mr. Williams came up with the "Floating Chamber" design, and the resulting pistol was put into production in 1937 as the Service Model Ace. An easy way to differentiate between the Colt Ace and the Colt Service Model Ace is that Service Model Ace serial numbers all begin with SM. Colt Ace values range from $300.00 to over $2000.00 depending upon condition, if you would like an appraisal we would be happy to provide one, for instructions on how to get an appraisal take a look at our appraisals page... Marc


# 441 - E.B.A.C. ( Unique Model 10)
3/25/97
Mark MAMI@MT.NET

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
EBAC (French Contract FN) Unknown .25 ACP/6.35 Mm 2+ In Blue Steel 131XXX

EBAC is molded into the plastic grips. There are French markings on the left side. Marseille? Sorry, I don't presently have the gun.

I do have limited information from Browning that this was an FN French contract pistol, a variant of the Baby Browning .25 Auto. Can you tell me more about it? Where, when made, company name, any literature or manuals? Particularly, magazine capacity, safety system, and operation? I'll gladly pay for copies and handling--let me know. Thank you! Mark

Answer:
Mark, my references indicate that EBAC is probably a dealer name or dealer initials applied to the French - Unique Model 10 pistol which was also sold as 'Le Sans Pareil'. The Unique Model 10 was first introduced in 1923 and was a copy of the 1906 Browning without a grip safety and an Eibar - type safety catch located about half way along the frame. The following are the only specs that I can find on the Unique Model 10, I hope that they are useful- Maker: Manufacture d'Armds Pyr'en'ees Francaises, Hendaye, Type: automatic pistol (blowback), Magazine capacity: seven rounds, Overall length: 104mm, Weight unloaded: 12.7oz, Barrel length: 53mm... Marc


# 478 - Model 58 Winchester
3/24/97
Jim

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester 58-22short .22 S/l/lr 18 Blue Unknown

the only markings are on the underside of the barrel; "28" and "J"

What is it's aprox. manuf. date...? (pat. date 29 Aug. 1898) How nany were made...?What sort of collectors value does it have...?

Answer:
Jim, Winchester manufactured approx.. 39,000 Model 58's between 1928 and 1931. The Model was 58 was not serial numbered and was similar to Models 1900, 1902 and 1904 in that it was a takedown single shot with open sights and an 18 inch barrel. Many of the older Winchester barrels are stamped on the bottom near to where they fit into the receiver with their year of manufacture, and so I would guess that your Model 58 was manufactured in 1928. Values for Model 58's range form $100.00 to close to $400.00 depending upon condition... Marc


# 473 - Shotgun- Remington Model 11
3/23/97
Donald L. Wurscher dlwurscher@centuryinter.net

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Remington Model 11 12 GA 27" Blue 397XXX

None

I inherited from my father, the gun appears to be in excellent shape. I know I need to get it checked out by a good gunsmith, is there anything that I should be on the watch for, cracks, worn parts etc. I would like to be forewarned before I have someone look at it, that way I will understand what he is trying to tell me. Forewarned is forearmed, also Could you please tell me the approximate year of manufacture? Thanks for your help.

Answer:
Donald- The Remington Model 11 is just one of many fine guns designed by John M. Browning, that Mormon boy who used to live about 50 miles up the road from us here. Introduced in 1911, a revised version came out after WW2. Yours was probably made in 1941-42, based on serial numbers of military versions in my collection. Many of the stocks show slight cracks around the back of the receiver tang, unsightly but no big deal. The forends are a weak point, and often crack at the back where they meet the front of the receiver, but again no big deal. When the barrel is removed, there is a big spring and a brass ring gizmo, normally hidden by the forend, that need to go back the right way. That IS a big deal. No other particular problem areas on these that I know of. Have it checked, and then enjoy it like your Dad did... John Spangler


# 438 - Soviet Machinegun
3/22/97
Kimberly

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Russian ? SG or SGM ?? 7.62*54 R Belt Fed Aprox.22" with flash hider aprox.4-5" blue Not available

Carrying? handle on barrel. Mounted on 2 wheeled carriage. Metal shield/plate about 1 ft. sq. resting on top of barrel.

I recently viewed this weapon while I was at the range and was very curious about it. It was mounted on some sort of a 2 wheeled carriage or cart. It appeared to have had a hitch of some sort on one end. Was it mounted on a vehicle or pulled behind? I was unable to speak with the actual owner of it and was very curious about when it was produced and where. Any info you can furnish me regarding it would be appreciated. Was it actually mounted on this wheeled cart? How many were made? By whom? For whom? Would there be any other sources I could check with regarding additional info. This is my 1st.visit to your site ,And I must say it is very informative. Thank you.. Kimberly Sorry I am not able to remember any more details of the weapon

Answer:
Kimberly, thanks for visiting our site. From your description it is hard to narrow the possibilities of which machine-gun that you saw down to one. Many soviet machine guns have a carrying handle and are capable of being attached to a wheeled gun mount. The best way to identify your particular machine-gun, and get more information about it is to go to your local library and check out one of the two following books: Military Small Arms of the 20th Century by Ian V. Hogg and John Weeks published by DBI or Small Arms of the World by Edward Clinton Exell published by Stackpole Books. Both books are informative and very well written, both books have many photographs that may help in identifying the particular machine-gun that you saw... Marc *** John came up with an answer also **** The Russians seem to be unique in their use of a wheeled mount for some of their machine guns. The mount is called a "Sokolov" mount, presumably named after the comrade who invented it. These were in use from about 1910 thru the end of WW2 and many were passed on to the CHICOMS for use in Korea. The wheels allowed the machine gun to be pulled along by the soldiers, or by horses. For winter operations, they put skis under the mount. The mount could be stood up on the poles you would normally pull on, and braced in position to hold it high enough for anti-aircraft use. Pretty neat. The shield gave the gunner some protection against shell or grenade fragments and less against rifle fire. All right already- but what kind of gun was it? Three likely candidates- If water-cooled, it was a Maxim, using 7.62x54R ammo. These were adopted for Russian use by 1905, and various versions continued in production through WW2. Over 270,000 were made in 1944 alone. Weight of the Maxim with full water jacket and mount was 145 pounds, so even John Wayne wouldn't want to carry one very far. Improvements were suggested by Tokarev and


# 440 - Pedersen Device & Springfield M1903 Mark I Rifle
3/22/97
Steve

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
U.S. Springfield Armory Model 1903 Mark I 30-06 Unknown Parkerized Dark(black?) 117XXXX

SA over Ordinance Bomb over 3-20 over A on muzzle end of barrel."SA" over Bomb over "3-20" over "A" The rifle has all it's original parts, two piece sear, trigger, and cut off. The Parkerization is about 50% on the receiver and better on most of the parts. The only part that seems to be wrong is the stock, it is a scant pistol grip type and marked BA-WL inside a rectangle. The rifle is great mechanically and has a very bright bore.

I have read Bruse N. Canfield's collector's guide and know the basic history of the pederson device, What I want to know is where I can find more information on the Pederson device including and technical information, drawings, etc. I'm also interested in finding information about any web gear, ammo, and other special equipment made for the Mark I rifle.

Answer:
Steve- Good Mark Is are getting very hard to find, especially with the right parts. Check your cutoff spindle- it should have a screwdriver slot on the exposed end. (Most people don't know to look for that.) That indicates the lineup position for the screw that locks it in place-in a machined out oval recess, not the groove as on the standard spindle. Look at every M1903 rifle you see with a finger groove stock. You will eventually find one with the small clearance cut for the Mark I ejection port. It is worth buying a whole rifle to get a Mark I stock. Just swap with the one you have and resell it. The best coverage of the Pedersen Device is in William Brophy's "Springfield 1903 Rifles". I understand that has recently gone out of print. In my opinion it is one of about 12 absolutely essential reference books for a serious US military arms collector. If you can find a copy get it! Clawson's book on Colt .45 Service Pistols went out of print at $65 and last one I saw was going for $200.00. I am embarrassed to admit that I have had a bunch of research material from the Remington Society of America to write up a piece on the Pedersen device, but have not yet done so. Gotta quit playing around and having fun and fulfill that obligation. Maybe next week.... Also waiting to get copies of some additional printed material, photos of the cutaway in the West Point Museum. Would like to get some more ammo and test fire one too! Last Pedersen Device I saw for sale was over $10,000. I also know of a guy who bought one for under $500 (WITH THE RIFLE!!!) I was 2,000 miles away at the time, but maybe I will get lucky, or rich, someday and own one too. About the only readily available Pedersen accessory is the pouch to hold five- 40 round magazines. I have a couple at $15 each if you are interested. Ammo runs about $1.00 per round, and sometimes you can find a box of 40 rounds


# 439 - Custom Rifle From Mauser Receiver
3/22/97
Jim

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
AItajuba Brasil 08/34 Unknown Unknown Unknown Unknown

Tell me how to make a custom rifle from aItajuba Brazil MOD. 08/34 .30 receiver I got a good deal on. What parts will interchange, and how to I fit a barrel and headspace it and what caliber should I choose, .308 or .223? Anything else I should know?

Answer:
Jim- Your action is indeed a Brazilian copy of the 98 Mauser. I think it was intended for .30-06 cartridges (hence the "30" after the model designation.) I don't want to end up supporting some lawyer's kids, so won't attempt to state what Mauser parts will interchange, or how to fit barrels, build watches, or design space shuttles. You need to invest in a couple of good books before you embark on a career of gunsmithing. Some recommendations: The NRA Gunsmithing guide, and anyone of several books with gunsmithing in the title; Howe, Vickery, MacFarland all wrote good ones. Details on bolt actions, and what every little lump, bump, or spring does can be found in Bolt Action Rifles by Otteson (I think). Owning (or having access to) some machinery like a lathe and drill press are almost essential. Plan on investing some big bucks for a good barrel, and some tools like action/barrel wrenches, chambering reamers, and headspace gauges too. Hope you are handy with held tools and files too, and some woodworking skill to fit, shape and finish the stock might be nice. If all this sounds intimidating, you might want to start off with a "kit" muzzle loader, or "sporterize" a few cheap military surplus rifles. Plan on making a bunch of mistakes, but that is the price you pay when learning how to do gunsmithing work. Crooked sights or boogered stock checkering are no big deal. Mess up on headspace or sear engagement and heads might roll! There are some NRA affiliated gunsmithing schools that teach people how to do things right. A wise investment!...John & Marc


# 435 - FN-FAL Or L1A1?
3/22/97
Jay

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Fabrique Nationale FN-FAL L1A1 .308 20" Black Unknown

I have heard that the metric pattern is better to buy because of readily available magazines. I always thought that L1A1 meant it was inch pattern, and FN-FAL meant it was metric. I have researched and have not been able to tell the difference in the names. Which name is inch, which is metric? Is one better than the other? What are the differences? Thank You Jay

Answer:
Jay- I got a chance to shoot some of these when we had Dutch Marines and Argentine Marines embarked on a ship I was on. Fine guns, but they ain't collectable in my book. You need to study up in one of the following: Blake Stevens FN-FAL (3 volume set available from Collector grade publications), or one of the recent editions of Small Arms of the World. The Stevens book is especially good, and if you are serious about these rifles, you should invest the $150 or so it costs for a set... John Spangler.


# 434 - Shotgun- Marshwood 12 Ga Double Ca 1915.
3/22/97
Chuck,

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Marshwood SXS Shotgun 12 Guage 30" Browned (refinished) 918XX

Pat. Apr. 20-1915

Who was the manufacturer? When was it made? Is there a ballpark value?

Answer:
Chuck- Not a name I can match with a maker. Gotta be made sometime after 1915 but probably no later than late 1920s. Probably a $50-150 item... John


# 430 - Colt Single Action Army, Made In 1874
3/22/97
Jack

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt Pistol S.A. Revolver 45 I Think 7 1/2 Inches Parkerized I Think 84xx stamped on all parts

Left side below cylinder is PAT. SEPT. 19, 1871 below that is PAT. JULY, 2,1872 To the right of this is U.S. Top of barrel is COLT'S PT. F. A. MFG. Co. HARTFORD, CT. U.S.A. The ejector rod is missing and the loading port door won't stay closed. Wood grips. Pistol shows wear but is operational. I also have the original holster which looks like the seam was re-sewn by the original owner.

What is the pistols history and it's approximate worth? It was carried by a relative in the Indian wars. Thanks, Jack Corson

Answer:
Jack- Your Colt Single Action Army, made in 1874, is potentially a very valuable piece. A proper appraisal would require physical inspection of the pistol to verify originality of all the parts, and minutely examine the amount of finish left or signs that it had been refinished at any point. Unfortunately a great many fakes of this model have been produced over the years, and many have had the numbers restamped to be "matching" but hopefully yours would be found to be totally original. A missing ejector rod is not a big problem (we assume the housing is intact, and just the internal rod is missing), nor is the disobedient loading gate. There are subtle nuances such as inspector markings which also influence value among advanced collectors. Values are high, and demand is strong for these early "Pre-Custer" guns in virtually any condition. Flayderman's Guide shows a value of $3,000 for this in NRA antique Good condition and $15,000 in NRA antique fine. The holster, depending on type, could be worth several hundred dollars by itself. Take good care of your Colt! If you have the name of relative who used it in the Indian War periods, it may be possible to get a copy of their military records from the National Archives. Let us know if you are interested in this. (Don't worry, I doubt if they are going to try to take back the gun that great-grandpa "lost" over a hundred years ago. However, they might like to take the one you or I bought a few months ago!)... John


# 429 - Shotgun- LC Smith 20 Ga USAF Issue?
3/19/97
robert

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
L. C. Smith Ideal Grade 20 Ga Double 26" VENT RIB Blue 202983 under barrel. fwe202983 on reciver

London steel USA-f <--- l.c.smith yaeal grade ---> hunter arms. co. inc. m'f'r's fulton,n.y.,usa

Was gun US air force issue if so what dates how rare and what value is it. was gun survival gun for pilot

Answer:
Robert- It is a little known fact that a few double barrel shotguns were purchased for military use during WW2, including some LC Smiths. I am told that they were marked in some way on the "water table" with US or ordnance bombs, or something. Have never seen one up close and personal, so cannot say for sure. They may have been used around the trap & skeet range, or for check out by military rod & gun clubs, but I doubt if they were issued for "survival" use in aircraft. There were some Savage/Stevens over under combination guns (I think .410/.22 Hornet, with plastic stocks) issued for this purpose, and they were marked USAF on the receiver, but that shows post 1947 use. That's about all I can help you with on this... John Spangle


# 428 - Winchester Model 1917 Enfield
3/19/97
DAN WENGER

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester 1917 30-06 Unknown Blue 69XXX

A star within a circle and a circle with wings

The sights are really neat. A peep sight with another that flips up and has markings to 1600 yards what is the best way to sight in this rifle? and what book or books to you recommend this rifle thank you Dan wenger

Answer:
Dan- Your Model 1917 rifle was made in late 1917, and were used in large numbers by US troops in WWI, and most were later given out as foreign aid to allies during WW2. Sighting is just like any other peep sight, center the front sight in the rear, and put the blade right where you want to hit ("center hold") or at the bottom of the black Bullseye on the target ("six-o'closk hold"). The only book is Ian Skennerton's out of print "U.S. Enfield" but Bruce Canfield had an article in Man at Arms about a year ago, and the American Rifleman had a pair of good articles about 10 years ago... John Spangler


# 427 - Colt London Navy
3/19/97
Buddy Rudd

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt London Navy Unknown 5" Unknown 64XX

On Barrel: "ADDRESS COL. COLT LONDON" Revolver - 5 Shot Cap - Ram Rod Configuration

Inherted this firearm recently. Someone who knows slightly more than I (Not Much) thinks it an 1851 Colt Navy Revolver. Simply would like to confirm what I have, and based on the Serial Number, if anyone can provide a more precise date of issue... THANKS

Answer:
Buddy- You have a very good item, our records indicate that your Colt was manufactured in 1854. The London Colt Navy revolvers are quite a bit scarcer than the ones made in the US. The cylinder should have a small crown over "V" marking on each of the chambers and probably two on the barrel. Very collectable, and they have a good demand. Unfortunately very little is known about issue and use of these, since most were privately purchased by various English folks. Would appreciate it if you would tell us all the markings you can find anywhere on it. We might be able to tell you more then. If you decide you want to sell it, we can help there. Sold a good London Navy for $950 about 4 months ago... John Spangler


# 425 - S&W Schofield 1st/2nd Model
3/19/97
Jake

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
S&W Schofield ?45 S&W? 7 in. UnK./ brn. 36XX

This piece has a second md. latch, but appears to have been added, as the latch retains it blue. It is not US marked.

So is it a first mod. or a second mod. upgraded? date of mfg.? any info. apprec.

Answer:
Jake- Beats me! Of course I am pretty dumb about S&Ws, but I am bright enough to know there is a true expert on them. Even wrote a book on them. Jim Supica answers questions over at www.antiqueguns.com. Bet he can tell you! Hope this helps... John & Marc


# 424 - "Recent Import" Surplus East German Police Pistol
3/19/97
Jorge

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Walther ?? ac 7.65 3.75 Blue 28XXX

Marked "ac" (No date), also, "1001-0-cal 7.65", also "zella-mehlis, germany"all on the left side slide. On the right frame it has the serial number "28510" and "hammerli, tiengen"and also marked 1001/1 on the frame under the right handle. On the left frame "G. P. Trading, St. Alb. Vt." It has the "East German Eagle"proof and the "Crown Over N" proof (two places on the frame and slide and also a "Shield with the number 16 in a Sun" mark on the frame under the handle. The barrel is proof marked with the Crown over N

I have this gun that is marked as above It was sold to me as being a Walther "ac" circa 1945. However, I understand the East German mark is for "after 1950" and that the sun mark belongs to East German Police. The handles are plain walnut with no marks. The slide is steen (not alloy). I'm trying to establish the age and origin of the gun. It appears NEW. All numbers match.

Answer:
Jeorge, as you know, the Crown Over N is an East German, Suhl nitro proof that was used after 1950. The G. P. Trading, St. Alb. Vt importer marking and the East German proofs that your pistol has would lead me to believe that it is a "recent import" surplus East German police weapon (the 1001-0 markings could possibly be some sort of police weapon number). The "ac" code was the WW-II German ordnance code assigned to Carl Walther, Zella-Mehlis, Germany, so your pistol may be a Nazi weapon left over from WWII that was reissued to an East German police department, or your pistol may also have been manufactured after WWII using leftover wartime parts. You didn't say weather your frame is steel or alloy, but if the frame is alloy the pistol is probably of post war manufacture. All East German recent import pistols that I have seen have been reconditioned. I think that the East Germans reconditioned and reblued most of their pistols before they were surplused, this would account for the new finish. Without actually seeing the firearm, I am really only guessing about what it might be, if you want to send me some pictures, I might be able to give you a more definite answer. You might try asking your question at the Century International site, we have a link to them on our links page... Marc


# 459 - Shotgun- Ithaca Hammerless Double
3/18/97
Blake

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Ithica Hammerless Double Barrel 12 GA 30 IN Blue 88XXX

The forearm is wide like the standard beavertail and has the usual checkering but on the front end it has a lip that slopes down.

I have checked around where I live but no one has ever seen anything like it before. Can you tell me anything about it? If you need a picture of it let me know and give me your address and I'll send one to you. I appreciate any help you can give. Thanks, Blake.

Answer:
Blake- I'm no expert on shotguns, but let me guess on this one. If the sloping lip on the front of the forend slopes away from the barrel, I suspect it is for you to "grab a 'hold of" to remove the forend so you can disassemble the gun. Some forends have hidden catches that are removed this way, others have a small lever with a recess to get a finger underneath to lift it, and still others have the forend secured to the barrels with a screw. If this isn't a good explanation, remember, our free advice comes with a full money back guarantee. By the way, unless your gun is a "NID" New Ithaca Double, it falls in the serial number range for guns made around 1902-1906... John


# 426 - Shotgun- Whitney Arms Rolling Block
3/15/97
Michael

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Whitney Arms Co. New Haven Ct. Rolling Block Shotgun 20 Ga or very close appx 32" from breech to end. appears to have been blue originally. 84439

U.S. on top of the butt plate. upper tang on buttstock: WHITNEY ARMS CO. NEW HAVEN CT. U.S.A.

The barrel appears to be fluid steel, not damascus, and it appears to be in reasonably good condition physically. What is the approximate age and value, and if you have the information, what types of loads were in use when it was made, and might be safe for use in it today (Black Powder I presume?)Thank you in advance.

Answer:
Michael- Between 1881 and 1888 Whitney made a lot of rolling blcoks, similar to the Remingtons, but not identical. Included were about 1,000 shotguns, mostly in 20 ga but sometimes in 12, 14, or 16 ga. Barrel lengths included 20, 23, 26, and 30 inches, with the latter two most sommon. Flayderman lists these at about $175 in NRA antique Very Good, and $350 in NRA antique Fine. Not a real strong demand for these, but they are a couple steps up from the more common old shotguns we keep hearing about... John


# 417 - Probably Luger ?
3/15/97
Brent Thompson

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Probably Luger Unknown 9 mm? 3 1\8 Inches Blue 47XX

This pistol was brought back from Germany by my grandfather after WWII. It is your typical Luger style. The numbers 4788 appear just above the trigger guard and are readable if the gun is pointed at you. The German eagle is stamped on the barrel and chamber. There are 2 more German eagles, different from the first two, stamped on the chamber. One eagle has WaA66stamped underneath and the other has what appears to be an H. There appear to be no other markings on the pistol.

Can you tell me anything about this pistol? Where was it made? When? etc.

Answer:
Brent, You didn't give us much information to go on. All that we can determine from your description is that you might have a Luger that was made by Mauser during WWII. WaA66 is the German WW-II Heerswaffenamt inspector's mark on arms produced at Mauser Werke AG, Oberndorf am Neckar, Germany. To be able to supply you with more information we need a better description and maybe even some pictures. Take a look at our appraisals page to get an idea of the kind of information that we need, you may even want us to provide an appraisal...Marc


# 415 - Shotgun- Manhattan Arms Co.
3/15/97
David

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Manhattan Arms Co. Double Barrel Shotgun 12 Ga 30 In. Nickle (I Think) 16XX

Is this gun more valuable than any of the other billion or so double barrel shotguns out there? Can I find out any information about Manhattan Arms CO?

Answer:
David- Maybe a little more, but still not a heck of a lot. Flayderman's Guide has a little on Manhattan Arms Co. (but no shoguns are listed) but the real book (and only one) is "Manhattan Firearms" by Waldo Nutter. (No foolin- that is the real author.) Unfortunately it is out of print and going for about $100 when you find one. The Manhattan name may have been used by another firm later, but I don't have access to my other reference material right now to confirm this... John


# 421 - Dreyse "Deuling Pistol"
3/15/97
Rolf

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
V. Dreyse Sommerda Unknown Unknown Unknown Unknown 37XX

Cal:d.Zdsp: 0,35) 1/24Pulv: 1 1/2/24 Schroot

This is a dueling pistol which was found in Germany during WWII by an American soldier. It is a pinfire non-rifled barrel. I'm looking for any information concerning this gun.

Answer:
Rolf- We need a picture to be sure, but I would bet that you have a "Zimmerzchutzen" or "parlor pistol" used in indoor target shooting in the late 1800s and early 1900s. You didn't mention caliber, but I would bet it is about .22 caliber. Pinfires are not well-like by American Collectors. (Hey a great idea for something to collect that might be cheap enough to be affordable!) They generally have very traditional "dueling pistol" type stocks, so it would be easy to confuse. True dueling pistols came in precisely matched pairs, in calibers large enough to kill the execrable swine who insulted one's honor. However, dueling was rapidly falling off by the time pinfires came into widespread use... John Spangler


# 447 -
3/13/97
Dmitry Baranov

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
German Mauser mod. 1910/14 .32 ACP ??? blue Unknown

The gun has a mark "SA" on every part of it (barrel, clip etc.)

What does this marking mean ?

Answer:
Dmitry - without seeing your pistol, it is hard to say for sure what the SA markings might signify. Pistols issued to Nazi party officials were sometimes marked with an SA, but the Nazi party SA marking was usually something like "SA der NSDAP Gruppe Alpenland" and it was usually stamped on the slide or the front grip strap, not on every individual part of the firearm. If your Mauser is a NSDAP pistol it could be quite valuable depending upon it's condition. If you would like to send us some pictures we could probably give you a better answer... Marc


# 418 - Shotgun- Volunteer Arms
3/12/97
John

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Volunteer Arms Unknown Believe It Is 16 Ga Or 12 Ga Approx 30 Inches Blue 27XXX

What can you tell me about this shotgun and the manufacturer ? I inherited it from my father and would like to know as much about it as possible. Thanks, John Moody

Answer:
John- Sorry we can't tell you anything about this one. Every Farmhouse had one or two inexpensive guns to help put food on the table and strangers on the run. Still good to have one for the latter use, or as an old family keepsake... John Spangler


# 419 - Winchester Model 37 Shotgun
3/12/97
John

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester Model 37 16 Ga 30 In. Blue did not see one.

What can you tell me about this shotgun ? Was inherited from my father. Thanks, John

Answer:
John, you could not find a serial number on your Model 37, because Winchester Model 37 shotguns were not numbered. The Winchester Model 37 was popular because it was well made and inexpensive. Over 1,015,000 Model 37's were manufactured from 1936 to 1963 and another 600,000+ were manufactured between 1968 and 1980 as the Model 370 and the Model 37A. In my opinion Models 370 and 37A were of poorer quality and workmanship than the original Model 37. The Model 37 was offered in 12, 16, 20, 28 and.410 Gauges and came only in full choke. Values for a Model 37 in 16 gauge would range from $75.00 to $150.00 depending upon condition... Marc


# 420 - Winchester Model 1873
3/12/97
john

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester 1873 38 Cal Unknown Appears To Be A Faded Blue Or Brown 552XXXB

Been in my family for years. Would like to know age or any other info available. Appreciate your help. John

Answer:
John, the Winchester Model 1873 was manufactured between 1873 and 1919, total production of 1873 rifles reached over 720,00. Model 1873 rifles were offered in the following calibers- .32-20, .38-40 and .44-40 centerfire. Early model 1873 rifles had an iron frame (the iron frame was changed to steel in 1884). Normal Model 1873 finish was blue with case hardened parts, deluxe models had a case hardened frame. My records indicate that your rife is a 3rd model and was manufactured in 1900. Model 1873 values can be quite high depending upon condition and configuration, it might be a good idea to get an appraisal...Marc


# 414 - US M1917 Enfield
3/12/97
Phil

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Enfield - Eddystone, Remington 1917 30-06 Unknown Unknown Unknown

My question is where do I find more information about the 1917 Enfield? Does any one make custom composite stocks for them? Is this gun referred to by any other name? Thanks, Phil Wilson NRA Life Member & supporter.

Answer:
Phil- Thanks for your support of the NRA! The correct name is U.S. Rifle, Model of 1917, but you and I and everyone else usually just call them 1917 Enfields. Ian Skennerton's "US Enfield" has some good info. Bruce Canfield did an article in Man at Arms a while ago, and there we a pair of article in the American Rifleman about 10 years ago. See our answer to question #352 for more info on the M1917. Sorry we don't know about composite stocks. I think they are those ugly plastic things. UGGGHHHH! I think Century was using them so you might ask on their Traders Den page (see link to Century)... John Spangler


# 407 - Mauser 98 Rifle LaCoruna 1946
3/9/97
Lou

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser ? 8mm 23" Blue F17XX

The words 'FABRICA DE ARMAS Lacoruna 1946' surround a crest on the front of the action. On the stock is a diamond around a crossed sword and ax. There are several small marks that appear to be four diamond shapes join at the points with one diamond larger then the others. The barrel has a number in front of the rear sight (1218). The bolt is numbered R-3302. Along one side of the action is the diamond shapes mark, the letters 'cal' in script followed by the numbers 792, the letter P in a square, and finally the letter R in a square.

I would appreciate anything you can tell me about this rifle.

Answer:
Lou- Your Mauser was made in 1946 by the Spanish arsenal at LaCoruna. I though many of these were made in (or converted to) .30-06, and there were scads of those imported into the US in the late 1960s. Yours is a typical surplus piece with mismatched numbers. I don't know the relative scarcity of the 8mm (7.92x57mm) versions compared to the .30-06s. I don't think its one has any spectacular collector interest or value. Just another surplus Mauser like those selling in the $125-250 range... John Spangler


# 406 - Stevens 25-20 Single Shot Ammo
3/9/97
Robert Peters

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Stevens Single Shot 25-20 26" Unknown 58XXX

I have a 25-20 Stevens that my dad bought about 1940. I would like to do some plinking with it. I took it to a gunsmith to check and identify. He thought it was a 25-20WCF. I bought some new Federal brass and a die set from Lee for 25-20WCF. After putting a few cases through the neck sizing die, I tried an empty case in the chamber. It wouldn't fit. The chamber measures 0.315" and the case measures 0.345" next to the rim. The rifle is marked "Stevens" ".25-20". It has a heavy barrel about 26" long and 0.875" at the muzzle. It has a sliding block action, It's Serial Number is 58XXX. As far as I know, the gun has never been altered, rebored or monkeyed with. I read somewhere about a 25-20 "Single Shot", is this what I have? Thanks Cartridges- .25-20 WCF and .25-20 SS

Answer:
Robert- You already have it figured out. The .25-20 Single Shot was introduced about 1882 by Stevens. It was popular, but too long for use in the Model 1892 Winchester, so Winchester developed the .25-20 WCF cartridge with similar 20 grain powder charge, but shorter, requiring the base of the case to be larger to accommodate the powder charge. The .25-20 SS cartridges have not been made commercially since about 1920. "Cartridges of the World" notes that "Most rifles for this cartridge have been rechambered for the still available .25-20 WCF." Remember, there are lawyers with kids to feed. We do not recommend this alteration, only quote it as a statement printed elsewhere. Have your gun examined by a competent gunsmith and we do not claim that this is a safe or appropriate conversion... John & Marc


# 405 - Model 1809 Prussian musket.
3/9/97
Willem van Opijnen

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Unknown Unknown Unknown 37" Unknown Unknown

To whom it may concern, I have been frantically searching the web for a source on old muskets. I would appreciate any information that might lead me in the right direction. This is a musket with an octagonal barrel 37". marked 1825 w/crown and the letters EW and P. The lockplate w/crown and then Danzig and the year 1826. The stock is marked 1820 w/X. Brass trigger guard. Could be flintlock to percussion conversion. Any ideas??? Where made, for whom??? Thank you. Respectfully, Willem van Opijnen

Answer:
Willem, You found the right place! You probably have a Model 1809 Prussian musket. The markings you describe are correct for this type musket. However, the barrels were usually octagonal for about 6-10 inches, then round the rest of the way. The stock would go to within about 3 or 4 inches of the muzzle. There are three metal bands holding the barrel and stock together, probably made of brass, but perhaps iron. The Buttplate usually had a three-pointed shield shape on the top. Overall length should be about 56-57 inches, and it is probably .71 or .72 caliber (about the same as a 12 gauge shotgun.) Most of these were converted to percussion beginning around 1839, and thousands were imported to the United States and used during the Civil War. It is possible, however, that your musket has been altered in some way over the years, or is a less common variation. If the barrel is octagonal all the way, it may be a "rifle" instead of a "musket" model. There is very little written about these, the best source being Frederick P. Todd, et al "American Military Equipage 1851-1872, Vol. i. Another possible source is the very scarce report by Col Aflred Mordecai on his visit to Europe and status of small arms and artillery developments circa 1855-56. Hope this helps... John Spangler


# 404 - Mauser FN 7.62x51 Carbine
3/9/97
Steve

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
FN 1950 ? .308 Winchester 18" Blue 13XX

Left side of receiver has the FN name spelled out and the city that the was made in Belgium. No crest.

This rifle appears to have been produced in 308 and not converted to same. I therefore place the date of manufacture in the 1950's. I've seen this in books, in 30-06, listed as the model 1950, but not listed as being made in 308. For whom was this model produced? Why was a military carbine being produced as a bolt action, when FN was then producing the FN/FAL in large quantities? Some of these have grenade launchers permanently affixed to the muzzle. Rumor has it that 1800 of these came out of Morocco.

Answer:
Steve- You already know more than we do about these. You might ask on the Century Arms page. (see links below to get there) Folks who hang around there know a lot more about current/recent surplus than we do... John & Marc


# 403 - Original Broomhandle Bluing Methods
3/9/97
bob

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser Broomhandle 9mm 5.5" Blue? Currently Stripped 105XXX

Waffenfabrik - Mauser - Oberndorf .a - Neckar

What is the vintage of this gun? What is the proper finish for it? What kind of $$ would be required to refinish and restore this gun and what kind of residual value does the gun have restored/unrestored.

Answer:
Bob, my records indicate that your Broomhandle was made in 1911. The proper finish for your Broomhandle is what is called European rust blue on most of the parts, and heat blue on others like the hammer, trigger and sights. The original European rust bluing process involves several steps which must be repeated up to 10 or more times to get a good even dark finish. When I do a European rust blue restoration job I charge between $200 and $300 depending upon how complicated the restoration job is. When I sell one of my restored Broomhandles I usually get between $500 and $550 for it. Unrestored your Broomhandle 's value is in the $150 range. If you have your Broomhandle restored it's value will depend on how good the restoration job is. If the proper bluing method is not used your Broomhandle's value will be in the $200 range... Marc


# 402 - Moore "Teatfire" Revolver Circa 1864
3/9/97
Reggie

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Revolver 1865 Moores Spatfire 32 Cal.?? 3 Or 4 In. May Have Been Nickle On Brass Unknown

Has a Rooster claw hammer with a sight groove. May have been nickle-finished over brass. Appears to load from front.

What is the value and availability of ammunition.

Answer:
Reggie- About 30,000 of these were made between 1864 and 1870 in at least three different models. They used a weird cartridge that loaded from the front of the cylinder (not the rear like everyone is familiar with. The back of the cylinder had just a small hole for the protruding "teat" on the cartridge to stick through where it could be hit by the hammer. This was done to get around the patent held by Smith and Wesson on revolvers with cylinders bored all the way through. The ammo is a collector's item. A recent catalog from an ammo dealer had some at $5.00 per round. Your pistol was silver plated on the frame, and the cylinder and barrel were blued. Grips were either walnut or gutta percha. The earlier guns were marked "Moore's Pat Firearms", later ones "National Arms Co. Brooklyn NY", and the last model had a hooked extractor on the right front of the frame. Flayderman lists them all at about $150-175 in NRA antique good, and 275-350 in fine. Neat old guns, and some were probably carried in the later days of the Civil War... John Spangler


# 401 - M1903 Colt .32ACP Pistol
3/9/97
Jeff

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt M1903 .32 ACP 3.75 Inches Blue 1016XX

Usual Colt M1903 slide markings

The serial number on this piece indicated that it should be a second model M1903.However, this gun instead of having the four inch barrel and separate bushing has the 3.75 inch barrel with no bushing. According to the information that I have been able to come up with, the serial number when the change to the third model occurred was at 104050.This gun retains 70% to 75% of what appears to be the original finish on both the frame and slide. Could this be the original configuration? I have talked to Colt collectors and have heard that many times guns have left the factory that don't fit into the "proper" configuration. Since this gun is only about 3500 numbers off of what is considered the official change to the third model, I have speculated that the frame may have been pulled off! the assembly line for some reason, then assembled at a later date with the later model slide. Any information you can provide on this will be greatly appreciated.

Answer:
Jeff- You already know too much for us to try to BS you. There is often a considerable overlap of old and new as features change during production reflecting old parts being used up and delays in getting enough new ones to assemble complete guns, or orders where customers want one like they got previously, etc. Another possible explanation could be a rework at the Colt factory at a later date. Sounds like you are serious enough about this stuff to become a member of the Colt Collectors Association, if not already one. Let us know and we will send you an application. One of those folks would probably love to discuss these details with you, and know a heck of a lot more than we do. Hope this helps... John Spangler.


# 400 - 1939 42 Code Luger (P-08) Markings
3/9/97
Henry

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser P-08 9mm 4" Blue Unknown

Top of toggle: 42 - Top of receiver: 1939 - Right of receiver: 3 Nazi eagles, 2 with "63" at the bottom - Below barrel: 8,81 - Top of trigger ring: "t" in gothic or scriptive form.

Excluding the code 42, do you know what the additional markings represent? Also, I am very interested in tracing the history of the firearm. Such as, was it issued to regular army and/or who it was it issued to? Any thoughts on how to answer these questions. Finally, all serial numbers match on the weapon including the 2 magazines. It also has walnut grips and 95% original bluing. Could you give an approximate apprasial? I appreciate any comments you have. Thank-you, Henry

Answer:
Henry, it sounds like you have a very nice military issue Luger, the matching magazines add to your Luger's value. I would estimate that a 1939 dated 42 code Luger in 95% condition with 2 matching magazines would sell in the $500 - $700 dollar range if it is original and has not been refinished. Now to get to the markings - The scriptive "t" is part of your Luger's serial number. 1939 vintage Luger serial numbers have four digits followed by a letter, in your case "t", your magazines should also be marked with the letter "t" and an inspectors mark. The 8,81 marking is your Luger's bore size, and the eagles with 63 below them are German WW-II Heerswaffenamt inspector's mark on arms produced at Mauser Werke AG, Oberndorf am Neckar, Germany...Marc


# 398 - FN Frontier Bulldog .44 Cal.
3/9/97
Preston

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Fabrique National Frontier Bulldog C.F.44 W. 4.5" Nickel 21XX

Cylinder has Belgian black powder proof mark and next to it a "S" with a star above.

I would like to find out approx. when made, and any other info you can give on this revolver. Also is the caliber the 44-40 Winchester?

Answer:
Preston- Sorry, not one we are familiar with. The Belgian gunmakers have been making copies (or entirely new designs) of just about anything that might sell. Yours could be something old or relatively recent. If it has black powder proofs, I would be reluctant to fire it with modern ammo, regardless of caliber... John


# 399 - Browning M1910 .32/.380 Disassembly
3/9/97
Joe

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Browning FN 1910 .380 3 In. Blue Unknown

none.

I would like to know how to field strip the gun?A diagram would do.Thank you.

Answer:
Joe- Too hard to describe here. Your libray may have a copy of "Book of Pistols and Revolvers" by Smith. The .32ACP secion (p.246 in my copy) tells how to do it. The NRA Firearms Assembly book also has instructions and a picture. Hope this helps... John


# 392 - Artillery Projectile
3/6/97
Mike

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Steel Round (possibly Naval) ? 2 1/4" Across Bottom ? Blued? Unknown

7" high, 2 1/4" across the bottom. Marking are as follows "IVT TP M 86175 1/43 9-A-A-R" and on the bottom is marked "29" and "86" or "98". It has a brass band at the base. I estimate that it weighs about six pounds.

I was told that this item could possibly be naval. I am wondering if anyone can identify this projectile and tell me if something like this has any collectors value. I find this site very informative and interesting....Thanks, Mike

Answer:
[Hey, Marc! We fooled another one- He finds this site "very informative and interesting! Guess we better make up an answer for him then, huh?] Mike- The dimensions are about right for the U.S. 57mm anti-tank guns, which were called 6 ponders in British service. There are lots of dummies for these on the market. Usually have pointed nose, no provisions for base or nose fuze. Markings are sort to be expected on US ammo, perhaps British. The US Navy had nothing close to this caliber in 1943. Not sure about other countries. (Zip us an Email if you want a list of similar heavy ordnance items (all inert of course) that we have available.)... John


# 396 - Sendra 5.56mm M15 (AR-15 Copy)
3/6/97
Mac

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Sendra ? M15A1 5.56mm ? Blue 100XXX

barrel stamped C MP Chrome Bore, lower receiver stamped Sendra Corp Barrington Il also stamped with Rock Island Armory Inc. symbol

I'm trying to find out any information about this rifle. military or civilian. I've also never seen the M with the 15. Is this just a cheap clone?

Answer:
Mac- Sendra? 5.56mm? I thank that is one of them things they make out of plastic and aluminum, painted black so they look ugly to scare the anti-gun people. Rock Island Armory Inc. is a civilian firm, having nothing to do with the U.S. Government's Rock Island Arsenal. The military M15 was the short-lived variant of the 7.62mm M14 rifle. No telling what monstrosities have been conjured up by civilians and called M???. Sorry we can't help much. We know more about the old-timey guns where they chopped down walnut trees and used color case hardening and carefully done blue finishes. We like the old ones so much we even buy them... John & Marc


# 395 - WInchester 97 Trench Gun
3/6/97
Andy

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester 1897 12ga 19 1/4" Blue 207XXX

small"c"above serial number

Is this a trench gun? It matches a photo that I saw in a book, but it has no military markings. A friend said it couldn't be a trench without these markings. Also, if it is a trench, would it be worth restoring? It has been re-blued and has a small crack in the stock, but is very good mechanical condition. Thank you for your help.

Answer:
Andy- It is very unlikely that your gun is a genuine military "trench gun". Most fell into well established serial number ranges during WW1 and WW2 years. Yours was made in 1904. The "C" indicates certain design changes for repair part identification purposes. (Started with A and by 1917 were up to E). About 90% of all 97's have that crack in the stock, but they just keep on working anyway. WW2 contract military shotguns were marked at the time of manufacture. WW2 guns purchased on the open market were marked right away. WWI contract shotguns were not marked at time of purchase, but were supposed to be marked in the field several years later. Some got marked, some did not. Some additional M97 shotguns of various vintages were donated for military use during WW2. These could have been rigged up as "trench guns". A lot of M97s have had handguards stuck on them and sold as repros, or "fillers" for collectors/reanactors. (I did this with about 6 myself---wish I had kept the handguard and thrown the guns away.) Unfortunately some have been put together and sold for big money by liars, thieves, cheats and scoundrels as genuine trench guns to unsuspecting collectors. There are 3 to 6 different bayonet lug/handguard combinations. If you have an incorrect match yours is probably not GI. Even if correct, it still might not be. Genuine 97 trench guns had factory installed small base 1 1/4 inch Winchester sling swivels on the butt, and a magazine plug with a small tit on the end, not the push-pin takedown type. Barrels were marked "CYL". Some other features too, but too hard to describe. Anyway, if you are sure yours is not a real trench, I sure could use a couple more bayonet lugs/handguards to restore real trench guns that are missing them... John Spangler


# 393 - Roth-Steyer M1907 Disassembly
3/6/97
Gregory

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Roth-Steyr 1907 8mm Steyr Std Blue Unknown

I have been unable to locate any information on take-down of the 1907 Roth-Steyr. Do you know where I can obtain field stripping instructions, or can you provide a quick summary of the procedure? Thanks in advance for your help.

Answer:
Gregory- Neither "Small Arms of the World" nor "Book of Pistols and Revolvers", nor the NRA assembly books have disassembly info on this. Put us an ad on our "Wanted" page asking for help. Someone must know how to get it apart... John


# 388 - German Double Barrel Rifle
3/4/97
Mike michael.grossmann@stjude.org

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Joh. Jac. Reeb, Hofbuchenmacher In Bonn Double Barrel Rifle 62/78 26.5 In Unknown 10XX

Proof marks "crown" over R, "crown" over U, "crown" over V

My grandfather served as a doctor in a MASH unit in WW II. When they entered Germany all civilian guns were confiscated and distrubuted to the officers. He brought back several sporting guns and when he passed away I inherited this one from him. I haven't been able to find anything about this gun maker. The gun is hand checkered and engraved with scroll work and scenes of dogs(?) chasing stags. Can you tell me more about the gun or where I might find a book to help me out? Thanks

Answer:
Mike- You have a nice classic German hunting arm from the pre-war period. These were made in various combinations of barrels, two barrels, three barrels ("drillings") four barrels ("vierlings") and rarely even more than four. These were usually custom made by highly skilled custom gun makers. Sometimes they were marked with the maker's name, sometimes the purchaser, or perhaps even a prestigious retailer. There are no books on these that I know of. Each arm is valued and appreciated on its own merits. The guy who wants one will pay big money for one that he really likes. "Like" might involve number of barrels, calibers, hammer/hammerless action, stock fit, carving/engraving style and quality. I can't determine the caliber(s) of your gun, but they probably are not the type you can easily get ammo for. Ballpark values on these run from several hundred to several thousand, depending about equally on the buyer and the gun... John Spangler and Marc Wade.


# 391 - Shotgun- Belgian Double Breech Hammer Type
3/4/97
STEPHANIE @ FAST NOT @ aol. com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
T. BARKER DBL.BARREL;side By Side, Breach 1529? T.C P16? 30 In. Belgium Laminated Steel : Blue UNKNOWN

Dogs etched on name plates on each side of stock & on underside of stock looks to be a small brass inlaid law enforcement shield/badge. The firing mechanism consists of external side by side pull-back hammers (sorry , I have an S&W 38,380 auto, and a 12-ga. , but I've never seen one like this!). Hope description is adequate.

Can you tell me anything about this gun and/or any possible history or value? ( I appreciated your reminder to those wayward individuals of the NRA and its importance .) Thank you for your time and consideration of my question!! STEPHANIE, CA.

Answer:
Stephanie- Sorry to inform you that your shotgun is just another one of the common 1890-1920 period imports with little collector interest except as wall hangers. Value is in the $50-150 range. The shield is probably not related to law enforcement, as it was common practice to put small plates "escutcheons" on gun stocks, either on the top of the wrist or behind the trigger guard on which owners could engrave their initials. Kinda gave the impression that they were classy guns, even if they were not. Stephanie- thanks for your support of the NRA. Besides money, send polite letters to your lawmakers, and the newspapers. Get active in local political campaigns. Too much trouble? turn in your guns now and avoid the wait later... John


# 390 - Brooklyn Firearms Co. (Slocum) .32 RF Revolver
3/4/97
Dave dbrawn716@aol.com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
B.A.co Brass Frame Engraved Revolver Unknown As Close As I Can Tell 31 Or 32 Rimfire 3 Inches None Left On Steel Brass Nice Old 23XX

Roll marked on barrel is the following:B.A,co Patent April 14th 1863The revolver is a five shot. It is unique in that each hole in the cylinder has a sleeve that slides out of the cylinder onto a mandrel to eject the spent round then a new round must have been laid in the open cylinder and the sleeve lowered down over the new load.

Where was it manufactured? By who? For how long? Any guess as to rarity or worth?

Answer:
Dave- You've got a prize there! "Flayderman's Guide to Antique American Firearms and their Values" estimates that under 100 of this model were made in 1863-64, out of a total of about 10,000 other Brooklyn Firearms Co. models. "A unique design with individual chambers in the form of sliding tubes within cut-outs on the cylinder. Chambers slide forward one at a time over a fixed rod on the right side to expose, load and eject. Brass frame silver plated; barrel and cylinder blued or plated....decorative scroll engraving standard on frame... Values- Good $250; Fine $550." The only reason someone went to the trouble to design a mechanical monstrosity like this is that in 1857 Rollin White had patented the idea of a cylinder bored completely through to allow cartridges to be loaded from the rear. Smith & Wesson owned the patent and kept a bunch of lawyers busy successfully suing the shorts off anyone who made a revolver with a bored through cylinder. That's why Colt conversions were Theur and Masons or Richards-Mason lashups until the Rollin White Patent expired and the 1873 Single Action Army with its bored through cylinder could be made. If you decide to sell this, we can help find a buyer... John Spangler and Marc Wade


# 387 - Unidentified Linen Cartridge
3/1/97
Norm

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Unknown Unknown 50?? Unknown Unknown Unknown

Recently was given what I believe is a "linen cartridge". The projectile, judging by my black power rifle appears to be a 50 cal. It has two sealrings (lands/grooves), one exposed close to the casing and one that the casing is covering. The casing appears to be varnished cloth. Can you tell me when the stopped making linen cartridges? An old SEARS repro 1902 catalog indicates that at that time they couldn't supply linen cartridges for the Sharp's.

Answer:
Norm, nice cartridge you have there. It may be Sharps, but I am inclined to think Civil War era Smith carbine, which would also fit your description, but seem to be more durable and common than Sharps. For a good ID you need to check One or more of the following to compare with the photos or drawings of identified specimens: George Hoyem "History and Development of Small Arms Ammunition, Vol One" (Hoyem is not only researcher/writer of this series, but a publisher of numerous other books on cartridges. Collectors are fortunate to have gentlemen like this who devote so much time and talent (and lots of money!) to making this information available.) Also check Frank Sellers book "Sharps Firearms", and perhaps Berkley Lewis' classic "Small Arms and Ammunition in the United States Service" Some of the other books dealing with Civil War carbines might be helpful as well. Please take good care of that cartridge, they seem to sell for far more than makes sense. (I've seen common CW paper cartridges go for over $100 each!)... John Spangler


# 385 - Police Sauer Model 38 H
3/1/97
Len Scibilia

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Sauer M38 7.65 Unknown Unknown Unknown

I acquired a pistol which is, I believe a M38 Sauer. It has 2 eagle N proofs(Frame and slide) and on the trigger guard is a small eagle and swastika. To the right of this mark is the letter C (or possibly a badly struck O).Is this a polizei pistol? Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

Answer:
Len, your Sauer should have 3 Eagle over N commercial test proofs, one on the right side of the barrel near the muzzle, one on the right side of the slide above the slide grip, and one on the right side of the frame to the rear of the grip. The left side of the slide should be marked J.P. SAUER & SON CAL 7.65 or CAL 7.65. The right side of the slide may or may not be marked PATENT. The serial number should be stamped on the right side of the frame below the slide grip and the last three digits of the serial number should be stamped on the lower front of the slide where the muzzle contour begins. One of the police acceptance stamps that was used on the Sauer Model 38H is an eagle over an X inside a circle with the letter C stamped to the left. The police acceptance stamp should be located on the upper portion of the trigger guard near the frame... Marc


# 384 - S&W 645
3/1/97
Jim

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
S&W 645 .45 Unknown SS Unknown

This gun is by no means a "collectable" yet. However, I believe it is no longer made?! In my humble opinion, it appears to have collectable features and design. I recently purchased one at a gun show for $400. Excellent condition. Since it is no longer made, do you think it will increase in value through the years?

Answer:
Jim- John and I both wanted to answer your question, I hope that you realize what a great honor we are bestowing upon you! (Marc's answer) -- Jim, I have always liked the S&W 645's and when I have one for sale I often end up selling it to someone who is specifically looking for a 645 because they like them better than the newer model 4506. Pre-64 Winchester and Hi Standard values increased quite soon after changes were made, or the manufacturer went out of business, but values for 645's have not increased at all. I think that you will probably have to wait a long time before 645's become a hot collector item, unless there is a law passed banning them. (John's answer)--Yes, the Clintons think your 645 is very collectable already, and would like to collect it immediately. It is a gun; semi-automatic; evil looking; and therefore an assault weapon. Someone, somewhere, may have used one for something illegal (even though the bad guy was let go with a warning), so we would all be better off if this gun was immediately destroyed. You must be some sort of weirdo even thinking about collecting guns. Pretty ridiculous, right? However, a lot of people have exactly those thoughts about your gun. And they feel the same way about old cowboy Colts and Winchesters, and my flintlock muskets. I would not advise collecting modern semi-automatic guns as good investments, and would not be surprised to see continued efforts to make them illegal. Will those efforts be successful? Could a draft-dodging, womanizing, stretcher of the truth be elected to a second term as President? Can guns essentially be banned altogether in two other English speaking nations? Anything can happen. Support the NRA and other organizations working to preserve your gun rights, and political candidates whose ideas you support. John Spangler. This has been an unpaid, but heartfelt political statement... John and Marc


# 383 - Savage Model 19 NRA
3/1/97
Duane_Stagg@http:www.ews.pvt.k12.ct.us

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Savage Arms Model 19 NRA 22cal.L.R. 25"+/- Blue 39XXX

none

I am looking for the age of this piece. I am also looking for a replacement magazine. A 5 shot clip, (23A sporter or N.R.A. match rifle) written on one side and the other side has (22LR savage arms corp. pat-April 28 1908). It has a knob on the base.

Answer:
Duane, Aprox. 50,000 Savage Model 19 NRA bolt action 22 rifles were made between 1919 and 1937, approx., 6,000 more Savage Model 19 NRA's were made under military contract between 1943 and 1945. Models made under government contract will have US property markings and are worth about 15% more than regular models. To find parts suppliers, go to our links page and follow the parts link... Good Lock, Marc


# 382 - Colt Police Positive Special?
3/1/97
Timmy tblevins@iocc.com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt Police Special 32-20 W.C.F. 3 1/2 Blue 41XXX

Markings on barrel: COLTS.PT FA MFG HARTFORD CT USA PAT'D AUG5 1884 JUNE 5 1905

Found this gun in closet while cleaning out grandfathers old house. Just wondering about its value.

Answer:
Timmy, if your revolver is a Colt Police Positive Special, my records indicate that it was manufactured in 1911. Unfortunately there is not nearly as much collector interest in the older Colt double action revolvers as there is in Colt single action revolvers or Colt semi-automatic pistols. Values for Colt Police Positive Special revolvers range from $100.00 to $250.00 depending upon condition. If you want a more precise evaluation of your revolver's worth, take a look at our Appraisals page... Marc


# 381 - Netherlands Delft (Beaumont) Rifle
3/1/97
Fred (FredLom@aol.com)

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Unknown Unknown 11.66 Mm Or .4590 Cal Via Chamber Cast 29 Inches Steel 3XXN

Bolt action(right handed). Fixed Box Magazine. Cleaning rod beneath round barrel.N,F,N around octagonal chamber area, each letter with a crown over it. Date - 1875 in chamber area. Left side of wood stock 2 1/4" in front of steel butt plate is a 1" diameter circle with large W with a crown over it. Also 1875 at bottom of circle, and the word DELFT. Fixed front sight, and elevation adjustable rear sight.

What is this rifle? Any value to it? Any history on it?

Answer:
Fred- You have a Model 1871/88 Beaumont-Vitali rifle. These used a 11.3x52R cartridge. Most were made by Stevens in Maastricht, but some were made in Delft. Originally single shot Model 1871 rifles, they became 1871/88s when the "Vitali" magazines were installed. These were replaced by the Model 1895 Mannlicher, although some remained in use in colonial outposts or secondary units as late as WWI. Value? Not a lot, usually in the $100-125 wallhanger category. Still, impressive looking old guns... John Spangler


# 379 - Colt Lightening Medium Frame
3/1/97
debra@voy.net

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt Sept.18 1883 32 25 In. Not Sure 20XXX

Elliots Patents may 29 1883-sept.18 1883 Hartford,Ct.It is a 32 calibur slide-action, Colt Lightening Medium Frame. Octagonal barrel. This is all I have. Thanks so much. Also will be in fair to poor condition.

Would like to know history and value?

Answer:
Debra, my records show that your Colt Lightening was made in 1886. Colt Lightening's were made in three frame sizes, small, medium and large. Colt Lightening Medium Frame rifles were produced in three calibers .32-20, .38-40, and .44-40 (with a somewhat larger frame). Colt also offered Lightening Medium Frame carbines which were similar to the rifle but had a 20 inch barrel, and Colt Lightening Medium Frame Baby Carbines, which were a light weight version of the carbine. Values for Colt Lightening Medium Frame Carbines can go as high as $5,000 and Colt Lightening Medium Frame Baby Carbines can go up to $7.000. Values for Colt Lightening Medium Frame rifles range from $450 to $3250 depending on condition. I would estimate that since your Lightening Medium Frame rifle is in poor condition it's value would be in the $400 range... Marc


# 375 - S&W Safety Hammerless 3rd Model (Lemon Squeezer )
3/1/97
David dmoore@connecti.com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Smith & Wesson 5 Shot Revolver Unknow But Larger Than A 357 Magnum 4 Inch Nickel Plate 90XXX

The revolver has no model number that I can find. All I know about it is that it has no external hammer, a 5 shot cylinder, larger than a 38 caliber, It is now nickel plated, And it has a safety in the grip similar to that of a colt 45, or a Llama auto. Also when the gun is broken open to reveal the rear of the cylinder an extractor automatically ejects the spent hulls. It is labeled as A Smith & Wesson on both the grips, and the frame. The patent dates are as follows, May.11,60--Oct.2,65-- Aug.4,85--Oct.11,87--Feb.14,85--April 9,89--Jun.5,90.Could this be a custom built model?

What caliber is this revolver? What is it worth? How many of these are still in circulation?

Answer:
David, your description sounds like a Smith & Wesson Safety Hammerless 3rd Model (Lemon Squeezer ). Smith & Wesson manufactured approx.. 73,500 Safety Hammerless 3rd Model revolvers from 1890 to 1898, serial numbers for 3rd Model's range from approx. 42484 to 116002. Safety Hammerless 3rd Model revolvers have a 5 shot fluted cylinder and were offered with ether blue or nickel finish, 3.5, 4 or 5 inch barrels were available. My references indicate that Safety Hammerless revolvers were manufactured in .32 and .38 calibers. If your revolver is larger than .38 caliber it may have been modified or customized. I would advise you to have a competent gunsmith check your revolver for caliber and safety before you try to fire it. Values for unmodified Safety Hammerless 3rd Model .38 revolvers range from $100.00 to around $300.00 depending upon condition... Marc


# 360 - Briklee Refurbished 1896 Mauser
3/1/97
Mark@Vitesse.com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser Construktion 1896 7.63 mm Mauser 5.5" Blued 593XXX

WAFFENFABRIK MAUSER OBERNDORF A. NECKER

1) What is the date of manufacture of this pistol?2) All parts are matching. The pistol has been refurbished by Briklee and has a small ring of silver solder around the new barrel extension. I have heard that Pro Blue will hind the solder ring. Is this true? What will hide the solder ring.

Answer:
Mark, My records indicate that your 1896 Mauser was manufactured in 1930. I have never used Pro Blue, so I can't give you much advise on using it to darken silver solder joints. If you try to use any touchup blue to darken the silver solder joint on your Mauser, be very careful because some touchup bluing solutions can actually remove or discolor the existing finish. I have seen people use dark navy blue paint and a fine artist's paint brush to hide solder joints, you might try that method if the Pro Blue doesn't work... Marc


# 373 - Winchester 101 US Navy Issue?
3/1/97
Bob genestet@infogo.com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester 101 12 ga. 2 3/4" 28" Full over Mod. fixed Blue with engraved silver receiver K162xxx

The words "Super Grade" engraved on floorplate. Engraved coin finish receiver. Fine to Excellent condition.

Dear Mr. Spangler, This shotgun was manufactured between 1963 and 1983 according to Winchester. This is all I can find on this gun. According to the original owner, it was issued to him by the U.S. Navy around 1970. The Navy later asked that the guns be turned back in or purchased for $100.00. During your 26 years did you ever witness this? Can you enlighten me on the history and value of this shotgun? Sincerely, Bob Genestet

Answer:
Bob- I was never given the opportunity to buy any guns from the Navy for $100, nor have I heard of others having that happen. (Heck, what would I do with a five-inch gun anyway? My wife wouldn't let me keep it in the house. Plus, they were too expensive to shoot much, about $85 per projectile plus about $30 per cartridge case/powder charge even in 1968.) My serial number information doesn't help with this model Winchester, and the "Super grade" marking is inconsistent with the info I have on the Model 101, so I can't even look up a value for you. I tried contacting a friend who shot with the Navy Trap & Skeet team, but he hasn't responded. I will add to this later if he has some more info. Sorry I can't tell you anything useful... John Spangler


# 367 - Colt Gold Cup National Match Manufacture Date
3/1/97
Fred email: fashby@ix.netcom.com

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt National Match .45 Unknown Blued 22,000-22,500 within this range

-NM after the serial number.

I have been told that this gun is a transitional gun from the National Match to the Gold Cup. Looking in the Blue Book it does not list this serial number range for the National Match. I was wondering if you could tell me when and the value of this gun? The gun falls somewhere in the 80%-90% range. I don't understand why my Blue Book doesn't list this range of serial numbers. Any info would be appreciated. Thank You, Fred

Answer:
Fred, the first Colt National Match pistols were made form 1933 to 1941, these early National Match pistols were similar to government models except they had a hand honed action and match grade barrels. Colt offered early National Match pistols with ether fixed or adjustable sights. Serial numbers for early National Match pistols fall between C164,800 and C215,000. Colt Gold Cup National Match pistols in .45 caliber made between 1957 and 1970 have serial numbers that end with NM. According to my records your pistol was manufactured in 1967. Blue book prices for Gold Cup National Match pistols (NM suffix) and MKIV/Series 70 Gold Cup National Match pistols in 80 to 90 percent condition, are about the same ($450.00 to $500.00 dollars). At 98 percent condition, Gold Cup National Match (NM suffix) values are higher than MKIV/Series 70 Gold Cup National Match values. A MKIV/Series 70 Gold Cup National Match in 98 percent condition lists at $675.00 dollars while a Gold Cup National Match (NM suffix) lists at $800.00 dollars. Personally my favorite model out of the two is the Gold Cup National Match (NM suffix) so I will always pay a slight premium for one... Marc


# 363 - M1 Carbine Winchester Mixed Parts
3/1/97

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester M1 Carbine 30 Unknown Parkerized 5597XXX

Cartouche(sp?) on stock (no "import markings"), "W"s on foregrip and sling bevel, all appears to be Winchester, except for firing pin, hammer, and stamped rear sight (IR Co.). The firing proofs (punch marks) on bolt and receiver are present, but the "ordinance bomb" stamp is not present on the barrel, although it is marked with a "W" on the top of the barrel in front of the bayonet lug. It has a ratating safety and as mentioned, a bayonet lug. The question is, is this carbine "original" or is this somebody's shop project? I understand there was allot of trading of parts during the military production years between contractors and I am suspicious of the high number of Winchester parts. Thank you for the great forum for this kind of question.

Answer:
Bob- Surprisingly, the US Army never worried about collectors interested in keeping everything just the same as the day it left the factory. They went out and shot those guns, had bunches of 18-20 year old kids take 'em all apart and no one worried if they mixed things up putting them back together. Then, they decided to change stuff so it would be easier to kill other people, (or avoid getting killed yourself) and demanded that some new parts be installed. Now you and I complain about all these "problems" on 50 year old guns. When originally made in early-mid 1944, your carbine should have had all "W" marked parts (although a few parts were "integrated" from other makers at various times, but records are dreadfully incomplete on this). The safety was push instead of rotary type, there was no bayonet lug until late 1944, and the "flip" sight was still being used. These three parts were subject of a massive effort to update carbines in the last months of WW2 and in post-war years. The hammer and firing pin are possibly results of "integration" but more likely just got switched in use. Look for the ordnance bomb marking on the side of the gas cylinder, it was moved there in 1943 instead of the top of the barrel. As for originality of the remaining parts- everything should show the same amount of wear, and colors should be slightly different, especially the band/bayonet lug. The bolt should probably be blued. If everything is parkerized the same color, it has probably been "restored" or perhaps even arsenal overhauled. If you want to get into details on M1 Carbines, you should get Larry Ruth's book "War Baby: The US Caliber .30 Carbine" Join the "Carbine Club" (P.O. Box 251, Canal Fulton, OH 44614-0251, about $12 per year for great newsletter) This should not be confused with a couple of similar sounding groups in other states that I consider to be worthless rip-offs... John Spangler


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