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# 598 - Turkish? Luger
5/31/97
Victor, Converse TX,

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Luger PO8 9mm 4in Rust Blue XXX

The toggle is marked "DWM", the barrel is marked:"KAL 9M/M", the chamber is marked: "TC" and the right side of the receiver has an inscription in Arabic?. The grips are checkered Walnut and the magazine has an Aluminum base and is unnumbered. Also the safety is marked:"emniyet".

I haven't being able to find any information on this Luger, a gentleman at a gun show told me that it could be a Turkish Luger, and that they were pretty rare, Was he right?, What's the value of this piece?, the finish seems to be original and is in about 80% condition, thanks

Answer:
Sorry Victor, you have stumped us on this one. The only examples of Turkish Lugers that I can find in any of my reference books were manufactured by Kreighoff and did not have the markings that you describe. Your Luger may be a very rare and valuable variation. I would advise you to write Harry E Jones, who is the author of Luger Variations, at PO Box 43, Torrance, California 90501 maybe he can help you... Marc


# 601 - Custom Colt Commander
5/31/97
Greg, Casselton, ND, US,

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt Commander 45 3 1/2 Or 4" Stainless Slide, Hammer, Safety. Rest Is 48XXX-LW

On the front of the pistol under the barrel is WILSON'S.

This pistol is in excellent shape with a couple of tiny nicks in the black finish. It is available for sale and I was wondering if the WILSON'S gave it a higher value? I'm assuming the marking means it has been worked over to improve it. What would a ballpark value be?

Answer:
Greg, customized 1911 types are hard to put a value on. There are many modifications that can be made to a 1911 type pistol and the value of the pistol varies depending upon which modifications have been made, then you have to find a buyer who is willing to pay more for the modifications. When I see a Colt pistol that has been modified I usually think what a shame it is that some igit ruined a perfectly good classic Colt. If you are planning on buying this Commander I would advise you to check it over carefully, trigger pull modifications are very popular and even when done properly, can contribute to all kinds of problems as the pistol ages and gets more wear on it. The value that the WILSON'S stamping adds to the pistol, is very little or none unless there is some type of documentation like a receipt to prove that the work was done by Wilson and what modifications were made. From your description I understand that Wilson's is stamped on the bottom of the slide? It is entirely possible that someone purchased a Wilson slide and installed it on the pistol... Marc


# 604 - Remington 510
5/31/97
Scott, Medford,Ok,USA

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Remington 510 .22 Cal Unknown Blue Unknown

What years this rifle was made and where to find the serial number

Answer:
Scott, from 1930 to 1962 Remington produced a number of good quality inexpensive bolt action .22 rifles. The Model 510 was manufactured from about 1939 to 1962 in many variations including a carbine and a Routledge/Smoothbore model. My records indicate that the model 510 was not serial numbered... Marc


# 605 - BYF 43 Rework?
5/31/97
Don, Loveland, OH, USA

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser P-38 9mm Parabellum Approx 5 In. Blue, Highly Polished 35XX

BYF over 43 Small "L" after serial number Three Waffenampt markings of 3 lines over 135 Obligatory eagle and swastika :^)

I recently acquired this piece. It came in a presentation case (fitted), an extra magazine (also fitted in the case), three boxes of original ammo, and a nazi pennant that fits into the top of the case. While I collect firearms, I'm not familiar with these particular pistols. My question: Is there anything about this you could tell me? It appears to be "special" as I've not seen anything quite like it before. Most P-38's I've seen are "rougher" in appearance. This seems to be a finer example. Any help or pointers would be greatly appreciated!!

Answer:
Don, I am very skeptical about the originality of this particular P-38. The original finish for a BYF 43 (Mauser) P-38 is the rough type that you describe in your question. Mauser manufactured a " Zero-Series " P-38 pistol that came with a high polish finish, but these pistols had 5 digit serial numbers with no letter suffix like the small "L" that you describe, and were stamped with the Mauser Banner. There is a trick that you can use to see if the finish is original on a wartime production P-38. Examine the military acceptance stamps on the right hand side of the slide with a very powerful magnifying glass. One of the stamps was originally stamped after the finish was applied to the slide and so the metal in the bottom of the stamping should have no finish on it. If all of the acceptance stamps on the right hand side of your slide have finish in the bottom then your P-38 had been refinished... Marc


# 588 - Model 1895 In .303 British
5/26/97
Garry, Vancouver, BC, Canada,

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester Model 1895 .303 British 26 Or 27 Inch Shiny Steel 419XXX

I inherited this from my father who always said this was a rare gun because of the caliber. I think it was made in the early 1930s and that it was not a rare model but that most were made for different calibres. Is this rifle of any great interest for a collector and what sort of value should it have. It is in good condition but had been used a lot for hunting by Dad. The finish on the stock is mostly worn off and the barrel has no pitting. Thank you in advance.

Answer:
Gary, The Mod. 1895 Winchester was Browning's first design to incorporate a box magazine . Winchester produced over 425,00 model 1895's between 1896 and 1931. You didn't provide us with your complete serial number we can only tell you that your Model 95 was manufactured sometime between 1915 and 1927. The Model 1895 is very much in demand as a collector item, 1895 prices can range from $300.00 to over $5000.00 depending upon condition and features. The gun value book does not add a premium for 1895's in .303 British caliber... Marc


# 587 - Nickel Colt Cobra
5/26/97
STAN

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt Cobra 38 Special 2" Nickle Unknown

There is a small "p" in a triangle right above the trigger guard on the "cobra" side of the pistol.

I haven't seen too many nickel cobra's (or dect. specials). I was curious about the value of the gun as well as how many were made?

Answer:
Stan, the 'Cobra' is really the `Detective Special' with an alloy frame, thereby reducing the weight from 22oz to l5 oz. A government contract for an aircrew protection pistol, incorporated an alloy cylinder as well, though Colt never used this feature for commercial sales. Unlike the 'Detective Special', the 'Cobra' is made in .22 caliber, although the majority were sold in .32 and .38 caliber. Cobra's were manufactured from 1950 to 1981. I was unable to find any information indicating how many Cobra's were produced with a nickel finish. Blue Book values for Cobra's range from $120.00 to about $450.00 depending upon condition and model, add 15% for nickel finish... Marc


# 583 - Benjamin Model H
5/26/97
Austin

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Benjamin Franklin Pellet Gun H 177 19 Inches Blue 33XXX

None

Would like a price on what it is worth and any information you may have on used Benjamin Air Rifles.

Answer:
Austin ,I don't have much experience with air rifles (I liked them when I was a kid, but lost all interest in them when Dad gave me my first Remingtion pump .22 rifle). The gun value book describes the Benjamin Model H (no mention is made of any Benjamin Franklin brand name) as being a pump action with walnut grips that will fire a pellet at 400 FPS. Model H values are in the $50.00 range if the gun is in excellent condition... Marc


# 577 -
5/26/97
Jim

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Luger Pistol 30 6 Inches Unknown Unknown

Hello. My Grandfather emigrated to the U.S. from Germany about 1900 and brought a luger type pistol with him. It's been wrapped in an oily rag in my father's attic for the last 50 years and appears to be in working order (don't worry, I'm not going to try it until a professional has serviced it.) Anyway, it has a few very small ornate letter B's on it and at the bottom base of the barrel there is a fancy crest above the letters "EG", above a crest above a U, above"S72 28" above "3850". All that takes up only about 3/4 of an inch. I would like to keep it as a family heirloom and pass it on to my son. My questions are:--1) Can it be cleaned up and fired, and if so will that harm the old metal if I clean it well afterward, and 2)is it worth anything? Thanks much.......................Jim

Answer:
Jim the value of some old collectable Lugers can definitely be decreased if they are fired, it all depends upon which model Luger you have, and the condition that your Luger in. Your Luger may be quite valuable and I would advise you to have someone in who is knowledgeable about Lugers take a look at it before you fire it (even if a gunsmith determines it to be mechanically sound). If you can not find a someone in your area to help identify your Luger, you can send some photographs of your Luger and it's markings to us, you may also want us to do an appraisal... Marc


# 581 - Mannlicher-Schoenauer
5/26/97
Jason

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mannlicher-Schoenauer 1952 30-06 24" Blue Unknown

I came across this rifle recently, it was my father's and he had gotten it in Germany in the early 1950's. The rifle is in decent shape, but the scope that came with the rifle is in rough shape and needs to be reworked. The scope's manufacturer is Pecar and I have never heard of them, so I was wondering if they are still around so that I can send the scope to them and they could fix it. Also, I want to refinish the rifle but I do not know what affect this will have on the rifle's value. I know very little about Mannlicher-Schoenauer and was wanting to know if they are still around and where to contact them. Thanks in advance.

Answer:
Jason- Thanks for contacting Antique and Collectable Firearms and Militaria Headquarters. Your rifle is a high quality piece, prized by collectors and shooters. I would advise against any attempt to refinish it unless done by a well qualified professional, which will probably cost several hundred dollars. There are numerous variations of the M1952, mainly barrel length, stock type, single or double set triggers, etc. These were made by Steyer (themselves a very highly respected maker) on the classic Mannlicher design. Pecar was one of the less expensive post-war scope makers. Unless it is a claw mount design where repairs would be less expensive than the cost of refitting the mounts, I would not worry too much about repairing the scope. Getting a new one will probably be cheaper. That is a nice rifle. Take good care of it... John Spangler


# 574 - Japanese .22 Boys Rifle "Woodsman"
5/21/97
Leland; Moulton, Alabama; USA

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Dickson Woodsman 22LR 18 Inches (?) Blue (?) 35XX

Japan (Rifle is a bolt action, single shot. It seems poorly designed and machined.)

Could this be a post war "occupation" product, how common is it, what happened to the company, and what is a ball park figure of worth in average to rough condition. No rush on the reply. Thanks, and keep your powder dry. L. Free

Answer:
Dear L. Free (Hey Marc, think this is that FBI guy????) I can't find any reference to a Japanese made .22 rifle with the model name "Woodsman". However, Jim Perkins' "American Boys Rifles 1890-1945" tells us that about 250 copies of the Hamilton Model 027 single shot rifle made in Japan were imported in 1965. "Actually better made than the Hamilton" the extremely primitive design was simply unmarketable in the US, primarily due to safety concerns, and production stopped when the importers (Sierra and Cascade Arms companies in California) discovered dealers didn't want to carry them. This may or may not be the rifle you have, but it is as close as we could come with the information you provided. If it is one of these, probably a collector of boys rifles would like to have it for display purposes. They might pay pretty well for one in nice shape. Anyone wanting a shooter probably would insist you to pay them $100 to take one in "average to rough condition" away. Hope this helps... John Spangler


# 571 - Colt Single Action Army Revolver
5/21/97
Brad

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt Unknown 45 Single Action Revolver 5-inch Chrome Or Polished Steel? 165XXX

"Colt's PT.F.A." on top of barrel; "PAT SEPT.12,1871. JULY2 72 JAN19 75" stamped above the trigger guard

Just wondering how old this pistol is, any history on its model that you can tell us. It has been in the family for a long time. Thanks for any information you can give me. Brad

Answer:
Brad- Mighty fine old shootin' iron you got there. Made in 1896, in is the highly collectable and very pricy "black powder model". The .45 Long Colt caliber, with 4 3/4" barrel is considered to be the classic "cowboy gun." Many of these were originally finished with a nickel plated finish which many people confuse with chrome. Of course, many folks actually have chrome plated guns over the years, and if that is what happened to yours, the value falls off quite a bit. Also, if the plated finish has been redone (many were) that is not good news. The basic Single Action Army model was introduced in 1873, and variations have been in nearly continuous production by Colt and various imitators ever since. They are selling as well now as they did over a hundred years ago. Originals are bringing absurdly high prices. Rusty relic clunkers go for several hundred dollars. Examples in NRA antique good (see link for definition) run $1,000 while NRA antique "excellent" examples are in the $6,000 and $7,000 range! There are many variations and features which specialists get excited about and prices can get even crazier on those. It would be well worth the cost to invest in a "factory letter" to document the original configuration of your gun, and possibly where it was sent from the factory. (If interested, contact us and we will tell you how to get these letters). Further examination by a Colt specialist might be worth while to see if there are any special features (good!) or alterations (bad!) that you should be aware of. If you decide it should no longer stay in the family, we would be glad to help you find it a good home... John Spangler


# 570 - USMC Marked Revolvers
5/21/97
Harold R Scott, Fairfax Station,

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt And S&W Model 1917 Revolver .45 ACP Unknown Unknown Unknown

USMC

I have seen various ads for USMC marked 1917s, However I can not find any references that show that the ones sent to the Marines were so marked. Are these genuine or later bogus markings?

Answer:
Harold- Always happy to answer a question for a satisfied customer for many years! (Even so, don't forget to make a contribution to NRA-ILA or PVF) Let's agree on what we are NOT talking about. Colt made pistols for USMC contracts in a 1905 model (.38 caliber) and 1909 (.45 caliber, very similar to the later M1917 Colt revolver) with USMC marking on the butt. Those are original markings applied by the maker at time of manufacture. To the best of my knowledge, S&W did not mark any revolvers "USMC" on the butt, nor make any under USMC contracts. I have seen photos of US military revolvers marked "USMC" on the side of the frames. I believe Clawson's outstanding "Colt .45 Service Pistols" was the source, although it could have been somewhere else. (Marc has my Clawson book no, so I can't check). These markings apparently were applied during rework or at the unit level by a Marine Corps activity. I would consider those to be genuine, if not original. The bad news is that any evil person can do the same thing, and probably fool most people. I am not sure I would be able to tell a genuine one from a fake. However, I would be very curious about where the item came from. There is one Dubious Bum dealer specializing in US military handguns with whom I would never Do Business, based on a reputation for fakery. I saw his table at the Las Vegas show, and considered several items there to be highly questionable. Probably the only way to be sure a gun has provable USMC connection is to find one with a serial number that can be supported by a letter from Frank Mallory's Springfield Research Service. Be careful out there!... John Spangler


# 568 - Winchester Model 63 Rifle
5/21/97
Tony

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester 63 22 Long 2' Plus Black ( Blue ?? ) 95XXX

HH or ( HA ? ) near rear of trigger guard2 P over W marks where the rifle breaks down Wording on Barrel: "Made in New Haven, Conn.U.S.A." "-- Winchester Proof Steel --" "Winchester ---- Trademark ----" "Model 63-22L Rifle" "Superspeed & Super-X"Manual says made by: "Winchester Repeating Rifle Company, Division of Olin Industries, Inc."( Have many .gif pictures of markings and rifle )

Passed on from my dad... wanted to have it safety checked at a gun store - the owner said it was not a spelunking gun and made an offer that took me aback. Decided to learn more about the rifle. The NRA condition code is probably factory to excellent ( my dad bought the gun for us boys to use - %0!D we only did once or twice in the scouts ) I am not by any means familiar with rifle values, and I need to get an idea of what this one is worth.

Answer:
Tony- Thanks for the excellent information on markings. These really help, and I wish other people would take the time to do as thorough a job. Thanks also for the complete serial number. [Some paranoid people(two would be a paranoids?) like to use X's instead of the actual numbers. We ain't the gun police looking to confiscate their stuff. Maybe they are trying to hide something. Dunno, but makes our job harder.....] Anyway, your model 63 was made around 1950. These are very collectable rifles, as well as fine shooters. In excellent to factory new condition, this would probably get some collector excited enough to pay $600-800, especially if you have the factory tags and manuals and box for it. Now, for our English lesson today, we will cover two sporting terms. "Spelunking" is the hobby of slithering into dark caves. "Plinking" is that of shooting (in a safe location) at cans and rocks, etc. I much prefer the latter (and did so yesterday with M1903 Springfield, a BAR, Krag, Charleville musket and other items along with fellow members of the Utah Gun Collectors at our annual spring picnic and shoot.) For plinking, you might want to invest about $135 in a Ruger 10/22 at your local Walmart or K-Mart. For spelunking, a $5.00 flashlight is more useful... John Spangler


# 567 - Springfield Model 1873 .45-70 Rifle
5/21/97
Shana, West, Texas, U.S.A.

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
U.S. Springfield Trapdoor Rifle 1873 45 Unknown Unknown 38XXX

VPP by barrel. The model number says 1873 but I would like to know when it actually was made. How much it might be worth? Where I can look to find out more about the gun?

Answer:
Shana- Your rifle was probably made in 1875. (Springfield didn't put stuff together in exact serial number sequence, so occasionally a few rifles got assembled at later dates than we would expect.) You say you have a "rifle", which I assume has the 32 5/8" barrel. The number is in a range where both rifles and carbines (with 22" barrel and a "saddle ring" bar opposite the lock) were being made. There is a big difference in values. See links for definition of conditions; in NRA antique good and fine the values for a Model 1873 rifle would be about $500 and $1,200, while on a carbine it would be $2,000 and $4,500. Your serial number is early enough that the gun was produced before General Custer's 0-1 series with the Native Americans. Therefore, if a carbine, the value would be even higher. There are several sources for more info on Trapdoors. Most people can learn all they need to know from "Flayderman's Guide to Antique American Firearms and their values" (See our book catalog page for a special good deal price on these!). Someone who plans to collect a number of trapdoors needs to get M.D. Waite and B.D. Ernst's "Trapdoor Sprinfield" book with over 200 pages of wonderful details on this model. If inspired to become truly fanatical on the subject, track down the out of print book by Al Frasca and Bob Hill "The .45-70 Springfield" (now selling about $175-250 a copy!). They are reportedly working on a new version which has even more info, but expected completion date has slipped. For yet more information, Frank Mallory's Springfield Research Service has four volumes of serial number information on US military arms painstakingly gleaned from official records in the U.S. National archives, and he publishes a quarterly "US Martial Arms Collector" journal for us hopeless addicts. If still seeking further details, try the original manuals of the period, and the Annual Reports of the Chief of Ordnance for the years 1870-1900. (We have one of the manuals and a photocopy of the index to the Annual Reports for sale in our book list.) Anyone wanting more info than all that is sicker than I am and should seek professional help. Let us know if you decide to dispose of your rifle... John Spangler


# 566 - 1940 Mauser Luger
5/12/97
Leonard, San Carlos, CA , USA

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
? Luger 9mm 4 Inch Blue 881 maybe

Forty years ago I acquired a war souvenir Luger pistol. While searching the WWW for information, I came across your FAQ #69 41-42 Luger 10/27/96. My pistol under the barrel near the breach end has the number 881 with the number x62 above it. The number 881 has what appears to be a comma after the first 8 (8,81).The barrel also has 2 Nazi eagles, right side has a swastika underneath, left side has 655 underneath. The number x62 is also on the left side of the receiver and also appears on the front of the "frame" just under the barrel and receiver assembly. Underneath the "frame x62 number" is a lower case letter "c", in script form. On the right side of the receiver are 3 Nazi eagles, 2 with the number 655 underneath, one with a swastika. On the top of the receiver is the number 1940. All the "small" parts have the number 62 on them except for the toggle which also has the number 42. The magazine also has the number 62 on the wood baseplate. The grips are wood but the right grip has a Nazi swastika emblem, diamond shaped red white and black. The finish (90%) is blue, 4 inch barrel, 9mm. Holster with "takedown" tool has markings of, dkk with 42 underneath and an Nazi eagle with swastika and WaA195 underneath. The "takedown" tool has a Nazi eagle with 655 underneath. Thank you very much.

1) Is the ser# 881 and who made it?2) Anything special or interesting or collectable?3) If NRA FINE or EXCELLENT, what's the value?

Answer:
Lenoard, your Luger was manufactured by Mauser-Werke, Obemdorf on the Neckar in 1940, the 1940 stamped above the chamber is the year of manufacture. The 42 stamping on the toggle is the German ordnance code assigned to Mauser-Werke, Oberndorf am Neckar, Germany in 1939. The eagles with 655 below them are German WW-II Heerswaffenamt inspector's marks stamped on arms produced at Mauser Werke and the other eagle stampings are military test proofs. The 8.81 stamped beneath the barrel is the bore size in millimeters, all 9mm Mauser Luger barrels were stamped with 8.80, 8.81, 8.82, 8.83 or 8.84. Your serial number is x62C (WWII Luger serial numbers were usually up to 4 digits long followed by a letter suffix). The 62 that is stamped on some parts is a number used to match those parts to the pistol. The dkk stamped on your holster indicates that it was manufactured by Friedrich Offermann & Sohne, Lederwarenfabrik, Bensberg. At this point we run into some potentially conflicting data because the WaA195 stamping on your holster is the German WW-II Heerswaffenamt inspector's mark on assigned to A. Waldhausen, Inhaber M. Bruchman, Sattler u. Koffer fabrik, Cologne, Germany, or after 1943 Karl Barth, Mili tareffekten Fabrik, Waldbrohl, Germany. Code 42 Lugers are one of the most common of the Luger variations. The blue book lists the value for a "42" Luger to be in the $600 to $700 range, add $150 for the holster and tools, and $25 for the matching magazine (although I have never seen an original Mauser magazine with a wooden bottom). The marking on the grip may or may not add value, I can't be sure without seeing it, but it sounds like a Hitler youth emblem, maybe one of our readers can help to identify it. Let us know if you ever want to sell your Luger... Marc


# 564 - Colt(?) Percussion Revolver
5/12/97
Troy

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Colt?? Percussion/black Powder ??? 7" Parkerized, I Guess c xxx (on bottom of barrel)

Cylinder has sail boats engraved on it and says "ENGAGED 8 MAY 1843"Brass frame and guard, oct. barrel, rear sight on hammer, brass cone sight on barrel. cylinder also has the word "PATENT N" with a small star after and the letters PN under it(the star) there is another symbol on it with a star over it as well the barrel has matching stars and symbols (PN and the other) other symbol looks like it may be a shield???

Simply would like to know if this is a "Colt" or just what it is and a ball park of its value. I would say it is in very good to excel. condition needs cleaning but that seems to be all. Thank You for your time . Troy Troy0032@aol.com

Answer:
Troy- The naval scene you describe is typical of Colt Model 1851 "Navy" revolvers made in .36 caliber. That's the good news. The bad news is that the same scene is used on the modern reproductions, along with the Italian proof markings you describe. (The star over PN and similar ones). Value on these used revolvers varies with the maker and condition. A carefully used Uberti or Colt might be in the $150-$200 range. The "no-name" copies or kit guns assembled and poorly cared for and lacking a high quality blue finish are worth about whatever you can get for them, probably less than $100. Nice decorators, maybe fun shooters, but not a good investment for a collection. Hope you didn't let someone take advantage of you. We strongly recommend people read up on a gun before buying one. A $25 book (like Flayderman's) can provide the information needed to avoid making big mistakes... John Spangler


# 563 - Wilkes-Barre Shotgun
5/12/97
Dave Brimfield MA USA

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Wilkes-Barre Gun Co. Wilkes-Barre PA SA Dble BBl Shotgun - SS 12 Guage 26" Damascas Bbls/Rec In The White (no Case Color 7xx thruout

Patented Jan 5 1886 - Receiver engraved about 25% - nonselective extractors double triggers - Boxlock (hammerless)- Stock & forearm checkered - Lots of detail work that places it above the average and equal to some early graded Ithakas I have owned.

Flayderman's has a one line acknowledgment of this company and I would like to know more. Was this one of the many small Gun Mfg's that just faded away or not. This is a quality piece and I would like to find out more about it and the Wilkes-Barre Gun Co. Thanks

Answer:
Dave- There sure is a resemblance to Ithacas. Frank Sellers' "American Gunsmiths" tells us the Wilkes-Barre Gun Co. operated from 1892-1895. Edward Parry patented several design features and started the Parry Firearms Co in Ithaca, NY in 1892. Charles and Ernest Roth bought him out and moved the company to Wilkes-Barre around 1893. They made single and double barrel shotguns until they went bankrupt. Ithaca Gun Co. bought the assets October 1, 1895. Successful gun companies need good designs, good manufacturing facilities, and good marketing, and enough money to get all the above going. Sounds like they lacked something in Wilkes-Barre. It is fascinating to see how inter-related US arms companies were and how they really drove the rise of US industry by development of machine tools, precision measurement, etc. The same names keep popping up in and out of arms companies throughout the 19th century. Hope this helps... John Spangler


# 562 - Springfield .45-70 rifle
5/12/97
Denis, Delafield, WI, U.S.A.

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
U. S. Springfield U. S. Model 1878 Trapdoor .45-.70 Approx 32 Inches ? Blue (now Has A Brown Patina) 251XXX

On left side of barrel just in front of chamber: "vp" and an eagle's head, then a space followed by a "p". Just in front of the chamber on the left side is the letter s, located just above the edge of the wooden stock. Cartouche on the left side of stock above the trigger with "swp" above and "1883" below. Stock has metal butt plate and a metal cap at the fore end. 2 barrel bands. Sling rings on front barrel band and trigger guard. 21 inch bayonet with some surface rust, especially at the tip. With a box of cartridges, some with lead bullets, some with what looks like a wooden bullet. Mechanically intact. Cleaning rod and sight intact.

What a great site. I support the N.R.A. This piece is a family heirloom. Can you give me any history and an approximate value? Thanks!

Answer:
Denis- Thanks for supporting the NRA. We could not find any specific reference to your rifle by serial number, but a large number of rifles in the 250-251,000 range were issued to troops raised during the Spanish-American War in 1898. After the war, most "trapdoors" were placed in storage, and a few were issued for guard duty as late as WWI, and later most were sold as surplus. Yours sounds like it is all original. Despite the 1883 inspection cartouche date, it probably has mostly Model 1884 features which were phased in before the model was actually approved. Collector value on it in the condition you describe is in the $350-600 range. The "wooden bullet" ammunition is probably "shot cartridges" which were fairly common items in the early 1900s. A lot of people have used .410 shotshells in trapdoors over the years also. (We didn't say it was safe or smart, just that people did it!). Take care of it and keep it in the family. John Spangler


# 560 - Stevens "Favorite" rifle .32 long cal
5/8/97
Bart, Bloomington, In, USA

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Favorite Model 1915 32 Long 28" Brass?? R-717

The Trade Mark is Favorite Manufactured by J.Stevens Arms and Tool Co Chicopee Falls, Mass. USA single Shot Lever Action

I received this From My Father, as he did from his. I was wondering if you could tell me a bit of history on this rifle, and is it of any Value? Thanks

Answer:
Bart- About 1 million of the "Favorite" model rifles were made between 1893 and 1939. They were mostly .22 rimfire (short, long, long rifle, and .22WRF chamberings), but also in .25 and .32 rimfire. Although a lever is used to open the action, these are usually called "rolling block" or "falling block" rifles because of the way the breech operates. As far as I know, these all had iron or steel frames, usual color case-hardened, so I cannot explain any brass finish. It could possibly be gold plated, or maybe copper plated under nickel which peeled off; but that is just speculation. As an old family piece I am sure you value it highly. While we can't identify your exact model, the common versions would have a value around $150 in NRA antique "Very Good" (see links for definition) and $350 in "Excellent". However, price and demand on the .32 rimfire may be lower due to ammunition being about impossible to get. Otherwise, reliable old guns. My first gun was also a Stevens (Little Scout 14 1/2) handed down in the family. Enjoy and take good care of it for your kids, assuming we will still be allowed to own guns in the future... John Spangler


# 559 - Winchester Model 1866 Rifle- Turkish Contract?
5/8/97
David, St.Mary, Jersey, U.K.

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester 1866 .44 Henry Rimfire Rifle Steel/patinated 105XXX

Can you confirm if Winchester 1866 rifle serial no.105XXX was part of the Turkish government contact. The vendor stated it was taken from Baghdad Arsenal in 1917,however I have no documentary proof. Many thanks David Acon

Answer:
David- Looks like your gun was made in 1872, but I can neither prove nor disprove a Turkish connection. The records at the Cody Firearms Museum ("Winchester factory letter" source) for the 1866 model only include 125,000-170,000 range, except for less than 50 other early rifles. Maybe someone else can help on this one... Sorry! John Spangler


# 557 - Winchester 1887 Lever Action Shotgun
5/8/97
Bill, Victoria, TX

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Winchester Repeating Arms Co. ????????? Lever Action 16 Guage ? I Believe Is Was Blue At One Time 15XXX

Patented on Feb.18 and July 20 of 1886

Would like some general history and if at all possible where I might find a pictorial breakdown, because the hammer spring is missing. Thank you very much.

Answer:
Bill- We are pretty sure your shotgun is 10 gauge, not 16 gauge. It was made in 1888, and one of about 65,000 made 1887-1901. This was an early John M. Browning design, before he got into pump shotgun development. This model was made for black powder loads, so it would not be prudent to think about shooting it. I don't know of a readily available takedown reference, but maybe one of our guests can help... John & Marc


# 546 - Savage-Springfield Model 187H Rifle
5/8/97
Richard

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Savage Arms Corporation "Springfield" 187H .22 23" Blue Unknown

Has the following instruction on the barrel below the address for Savage Arms Corporation:"22 H.S. SHORT, LONG OR L.R. AS AUTO."

I would like whatever information you could give on this rifle, such as the dates and number of manufacture, market value and any other historical and information you might think useful or interesting. The rifle is in fair condition. I note that the lettering on the gun barrel is as followings (hopefully the pagination comes across accurately in this email): SAVAGE ARMS CORPORATION SPRINGFIELD WESTFIELD MASS. U.S.A. MODEL 187H 22 H.S. SHORT, LONG OR L.R. AS AUTO.

Answer:
Richard- Sorry, can't find a thing in my reference books on this. I think I have seen this model though, and there was even a military looking version made up for possible sales as a trainer in the late 40s or early 50s. As with most of the "off brand" Savage and Stevens arms, they have limited collector interest, were made in fairly large numbers. I'd guess (emphasize guess!) value might be in the $75-250 range depending on condition. If in NRA antique "Fair", you might even have a hard time getting $75 out of it. Wish we had more detailed information for you, but there just isn't much on these inexpensive fairly recent guns... John Spangler


# 542 - Flintlock 1756 Rifle
5/2/97
Nita, Saco, Maine, USA,

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
1754 Flintlock? Unknown Unknown 45.5 Inches Unknown Unknown

The date 1756 is carved in the stock. Also carved in are three letters. The first letter is unidentifiable, but looks like a capital F without part the top bar, or a capital H, with the right side worn away. It is immediately followed by TC 1756. Just above that is: IW 6The 6 is small and has a dot underneath. On the other face of the stock are 3 unidentifiable marks. A backwards y, a U or curved v, and a 1 or very slim 7 or Z. All of the above markings are hand-carved in wood, deeply, but not very neatly. There is a numeral 4 stamped into the barrel, close to the flintlock works. There are some very old nicks, dents and scratches and a few nails are missing, but as far as I can tell, that is all.

My mother-in-law was wondering about the possible value of a pre-revolutionary rifle. It is a flintlock (I think) rifle, all hand-made. Thisgun was found by a family member in the 1950's when they weredemolishing/remodeling part of their Connecticut home.Do you have any idea where to look for info. She is not interested in selling therifle, but wondered if it should be in a museum. I would appreciate anydirection you could point us in.Thanks, Nita

Answer:
Nita- You have a very interesting piece. Unfortunately the markings alone don't allow us to tell you much of anything. We really need some photos, and also some measurements, length of the barrel, shape- round or octagonal or half and half. Length and width of the lock plate, length of the trigger guard, shape of the ends, and pencil rubbings of any and all markings. Any information on where in Conn might be helpful too. There is some information on Connecticut arms, and a surprising amount of literature on arms that have Maine connections so we may be able to get some real good info for you. A whole book on Maine-made guns, lots of French and Indian and Revolutionary era information, plus some on Massachusetts militia arms (often in service for decades after manufacture) (Oops- some folks forgot that Maine was part of Massachusetts until well after the period we are concerned with). Send us more and we can tell you more. The Maine State Museum in Augusta has an excellent display of military arms. Once you figure out what it is, that may be a suitable place for it. If they don't need it, there are a number of private collectors who may be interested in giving it a good home. Looking forward to more info... John Spangler.


# 548 - M1903A4 Sniper Rifle Safety
5/2/97
Jim

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Remington 03A4 30-06 Unknown Parkerized 342XXXX

This gun appears to be original in all respects with and M-84 scope. However the safety is marked "BUEHLER" which I assume is a commercial part. Was this an armory item retrofitted or is this a civilian alteration? Any help appreciated. Jim

Answer:
Jim- The standard M1903 safety was the only type authorized for the M1903A4. Your Beuhler job is one somebody put on because it was easier to use with whatever scope he had on at the time. Your rifle is one of about 20,000 in the first lot of M1903A4 Snipers. Originally it had a Weaver M73B1 (military version of the 330C). The M81 or M82 (military variations of the Lyman Alaskan) were sometimes used in the 1950s, and by the 1970s, most of the 1903A4s left in National Guard armories had M84s on them. Your rifle should have "RA [ordnance wheel]FJA" on the left side of the stock (probably a semi-pistol grip or "scant" type) if it is the original stock. It may also have other rebuild marks, and often full pistol grip "C" stocks were fitted later, although some had them originally. I've owned about 25 of these rifles over the years, and lately they have been very hard to find. Let us know if you want yours to find a new home... John Spangler


# 555 - FN 1910 Manufacture Date
5/2/97
(Eric)

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
FN Model 1910 32 Unknown Unknown 403,6XX

On right trigger guard. "Lion over PV" and "Star over N" proofs onleft side of slide under patent markings. "E over LG over star inside abomb", "Lion over PV", and "Star over N" proofs on barrel over chamber.

When was it made?

Answer:
Sorry Eric, We can't narrow down the manufacture date of your FN 1910 very much. Records indicate that the model 1910 was produced from 1912 to 1980. Pistols manufactured after 1954 are referred to as Model 1955's and should be Marked BAC. If your pistol has the BAC marking it was manufactured in 1962, if there is no BAC marking the closest that we can narrow the production date down to, is between 1912 and 1954. Total production for model 1910/1955 was over 700,00, values fall in the $250.00 range... Marc


# 556 - Political Leader Wather PPK
5/2/97
(Eric)

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Walther PPK 32 Unknown Unknown 8327XX

"Crown over N" pre-war proof on right side of slide, barrel at chamber, and barrel at muzzle. "RZ over M" stylized circular mark on left side of slide to the right of the patent information.

When was it made? What does the "RZ over M" mark mean?

Answer:
Eric, your RZM marked Walther PPK is a very desirable collectors item. RZM marked PPK's were given to political leaders in Nazi Germany. According to the 1936 Organizational Manual of the NSDAP, the PPK was the "Honor Weapon" of Nazi political leaders. It is estimated that 31,000 RZM marked PPK's were manufactured from 1934 to 1936. RZM PPK's were carried in a light tan/brown leather holster which may or may not have been marked with a political leader stamping (large eagle over swastika) on the flap. Some (very few) RZM marked PPK's also had political leader marked grips which are also marked with a large eagle over a swastika at the top of the grip. If you ever want to sell your PPK let us know... Marc


# 550 - Mauser Rifle, Cut Down
5/2/97
Mark,Champaign,IL,USA

Maker Model Caliber Barrel Length Finish Serial Number
Mauser 98k 8mm Mauser (8x57?) 16.5 Inches Naked Steel 18XX

Left side of receiver: Large "Reichsadler" Waffen stamp, "1865", and lower case "d"Right side of receiver: 4 duplicate stamps in a horizontal row: tiny "Reichsadler" with numbers/letters underneath instead of swastika: "WaA823"Bolt: Stamp that looks like an eye (an oval with pointed ends, and a dot for a pupil. Magazine follower: Waffen stamp "Reichsadler" with "823" in clutches, and number "65"Top or receiver: Concealed by weaver scope mount. I have recently purchased a Mauser 98K from a police supply store in the city I currently live in. It has been heavily modified from its original state: The barrel, bolt, trigger guard, and magazine follower are polished smooth; the stock is! clean and smooth (obviously reworked); weaver rails are installed on the top of the receiver (the original sights were removed); and the barrel has been shortened to 16.5 inches (I have been told by the police store owner that this is the shortest barrel length defined by law). I was not aware of it at the time, but I can see that the weapon has bee modified to the point that I cannot doubt that its historical value has all but been destroyed. Nonetheless, I purchased it at a reasonable price (as my first rifle) and I would like to know how to maintain it. I have not been able to find any information on how to detail strip the weapon for a through cleaning. Also I have had a lot of trouble finding ammunition for this rifle - the only ammunition I have found is the original corrosive pre-war rounds with Waffen stamps on the rim! Any information on parts suppliers would also be appreciated because the previous owner (the one who modified the rifle) removed the extractor from the bolt in order to save his brass for reloading purposes. I have considered sending this rifle to Robar for "Roguard"coating,

Answer:
Mark- Congratulations on buying your first gun. This can sometimes be an expensive learning experience. Hope you didn't invest too heavily, and I would not spend anything on any fancy finish. As you indicate, the historical significance is gone, and you have strictly a shooter. Ammo should be easy to find, even WALMART and K Mart usually have 8mm Mauser, or just about any gun shop. I'd recommend against using the older surplus stuff- corrosive primers and brittle cases. Newer surplus is better, but clean promptly and thoroughly. For some history and disassembly information check the library in the 623 area (if using Dewey system, not sure what LOC is) for "Small Arms of the World" edited by either Joseph Smith or Ed Ezell. Some of the B.Dalton/Waldenbook places have them on sale cheap too. Loaded with great info. Good item to study up on BEFORE BUYING ANOTHER GUN! Decide what you want, either a shooter, a historical piece, and try to learn as much as you can before buying one. I got started with a Civil War musket in Junior High, and was getting a few WW1-2 military rifles from hoarded food money during college. Best thing I did was read every gun book I could get my hands on, so I knew what I was looking at. Also became life member of NRA while still in college. Okay- Finish- take all the metal out of the stock, clean it thoroughly with lacquer thinner and fine steel wool (well ventilated space) to get every little speck of dirt and oil off. Then a $2.00 can of black spray paint (flat or gloss as you prefer) or steal one from a grafitti vandal... and put one or two coats on everything. Keep it out of the bore, and the inside of the receiver where the bolt slides, and don't do the bolt or inside of the magazine. The Brits used black paint on their rifles, and we even did M1 Garand gas cylinders that way for a number of years. Barrel length- Federal law says you go to jail for 10 years and or $10,000 fine for rifle or shotgun with overall length of less than 25 inches, or barrel length of less than 16 inches for rifle and 18 inches for shotgun. Measure by sticking a stick/coathanger down the barrel until it touches the front of the bolt. Go forth and learn, and we hope you will come to enjoy gun collecting as much as we have... John and Marc


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This page was last updated 6/3/97 7:34:12 AM