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# 13894 - Norwegian M/1914 Markings
Leo, Burlingame, CA

Norwegian - M/1914 - 11.25 (45 Auto) - Blue - 27563 -

an ''R'' (our what looks something like an R) with a crown above it. An ''F'' behind the rear sight and some kind of a mark on the left side of the trigger housing. 1942 on the right side of the slide with some kind of a mark below it. I do not know what the marks mean. I know the gun was made in 1942 German occupied Norway. It is in excellent condition with very little wear and the only problem I can see is a slight crack in the right grip. What is its insurance value?

Leo, the Norwegians stamped this model with the inspector's initials. It is hard to say for sure without seeing the pistol but these may have been what you are describing. Marc

# 13861 - Johnson Automatics " Sporting Rifle ’’
Will, Bancroft, Me

Johnson Automatics - 2/9gGDP - 270 - Blue - 6082 -

I came across this gun a few weeks ago. Is it one of Johnson's custom made ones, and what is it's value? Condition is good.

Will- While Melvin M. Johnson is best know for his semi-auto Model 1941 rifle, and to a lesser extent for his machine guns, and a little bit for this rubber band gun, his company also made sporting rifles after WW2. Most turned surplus military rifles into fairly vanilla configurations for the period. Some of their work was apparently pretty high quality, and they had some catalogs or advertising that showed the various options they could provide to a customer.

Probably the best source for info is Bruce Canfield’s excellent book on Johnson Rifles. Besides the obvious focus on the M1941, he does a good job covering most other aspects of Johnson’s arms making projects.

As far as value, I don’t sense any great enthusiasm for Johnson Automatics sporting rifles. John Spangler

# 13858 - Belgian Gun
Mike, Fresno, Ca

Made In Belgium - ELG - NA - 75mm - Rusty - NA -

I have acquired an antique long arm and I cannot find any information on it. The only markings on it are the Letters ''ELG'', ''22.0'', and ''Made in Belgium'' on it. The diameter of the bore is 22mm. The barrel length is 75mm and the overall length is 132mm. I can send pictures if you request. Thank you, Mike Would you be able to help me find some information on this antique long arm?

Mike- I must admit I am a bit confused by all the metric measurements. THe ELG is a Belgian proof mark, and that is confirmed by the “Made in Belgium” marking. The “made in ----“ suggests it was made after 1898 or so when U.S. customs laws began requiring the country of origin to be marked on items imported into the U.S. 22mm converts to about .90 caliber, so that is a very big bore. Assuming you mean 75 centimeters in stead of millimeters, the barrel length would be about 29.5 inches, and the overall length about 132cm would be 52 inches.

I suspect this is a fairly modern (mid-20th Century) piece made for the U.S. market. Stoegers and Dixie Gun Works and other outfits had some “old guns” made up in Belgium and marketed them under imaginative names like “African elephant guns” or similar, mainly for decorative use. Frankly, I don’t know enough about these to benefit from looking at photos, so that is about all I can tell you on this one. John Spangler

# 13738 - Trench Gun Barrel Value
LaSalle, IL, USA

Winchester - Model 12 - Blue - X -

Winchester proof and flaming bomb I have an original Winchester Trench Gun Barrel Model 12. I'm going to sell it and wondering what it is worth in very good condition.

Is it blued or Parkerized? Many of these barrels are Parkerized, and this hurts the value. I have seen them advertised in the $200 to $300 range depending on condition with the blued ones selling at a higher price. Marc

# 13728 - Coast to Coast Project Gun
Aaron, Oak Harbor, WA

Marlin - Model 40 - .22 LR - 21'' - Blue - 27117207 -

Barrel Stamp with Coast to Coast stores logo. First line is Coast to Coast Stores-MODEL 40- MARLIN FIREARMS CO line 2 MINNEAPOLIS, MINN-22 CAL LR ONLY-NORTH HAVEN CONN. Proof stamp on aft of Barrel : (JM) I bought this gun a few months ago for $47.50, the gun fires and was in good shape except that the bluing was gone and replaced by some pitting nothing serious. I planned on using the gun as a project gun and refinishing it before I tried on some more expensive weapons. I didn't realize that from the little information Ive found so far was that I had a rare collectible until I ( and this is embarrassing) began to sand and polish the barrel so that I could rust blue later this week. Should I continue to refinish this gun even have it done professionally or stop before I make things worse? What is the history and value of this gun anyway? I haven't been able to find much information.

Aaron, I don't think that there is much if any collectors interest in firearms that are marked with the Coast to Coast stores logo. Even if there was some sort of collectors interest, the condition that you describe the bluing to be in makes this rifle worth about what you paid for it.

I think that your little 22 is a perfect project gun, I would advise that you have fun with it and continue to use it for learning how to re-blue. Good luck, Marc

# 13857 - Two Band And Three Band Enfield Muskets

Enfield Musket - 1862 Tower On Lock/butt Stamped POSSIBLY 0.522 - Rusty - NONE -

The gun I have owned for about 60 years is a so called 2 band musket and is amazingly in excellent condition. Why were some models 3 band and what would mine be worth as I have seen relatively few for sale?

Sir- Military arms of the 19th century were made in several basic sizes. Infantry were expected to fire at long distances against enemy formations, and to stand their ground to repulse any attacks by enemy troops, using bayonets when their arms were empty. These tactics were the legacy of earlier tactics where the infantry were basically “pikemen” armed with pikes, and sometimes mixed with archers to reach out and touch the enemy before closing for hand to hand combat. In this context, the longer range achieved with a longer barrel was considers nearly as important as having a long “reach” with the bayonet. Thus we find infantry muskets with barrel lengths ranging from 39 to 44 inches during that period. (Indeed when rifles were shortened at the start of the 20th century, the bayonets were made longer to retain nearly the same “reach” as in the past.)

Cavalry, and other mounted troops needed shorter arms that could be handled while on horseback. Firing while mounted was not common, except as an initial volley, to be followed by a charge with drawn sabers. Carbines usually had barrels about 22-24 inches long. There were also carbines or musketoons with similar short barrels used by artillery men, but without the saddle rings normally found on cavalry weapons.

An intermediate length was sometimes made, usually with rifled barrels when the infantry was still using smoothbores, for the Riflemen, or Light Infantry who engaged in skirmish tactics in advance of the massed infantry. Barrels on these usually ran about 33 inches.

In addition to the major military types of arms, quasi military or police forces also had long arms in their inventory. These would include customs guards, jailers, postal guards, railway police, and in some countries forestry officials, gamekeepers, and of course ceremonial guards for royalty and the like.

The number of bands on a weapon was based on the very practical consideration of what was needed to hold the barrel and the stock together.

Hope that helps. John Spangler

# 13848 - Oddball French Model 1907 Berthier Rifle
Christopher, Baltimore, Maryland, USA

French - Bertheir - 7.5mm - Not Sure Where To Measure To, But Blue - 21563 ON BOTH WOOD AND METAL -

Mle 1907 - 5 M34 MAS and CAL 7.5. Also has serial numbers as well as 1936 etched in metal on top of barrel under removable piece of wood. Sling ring on lower stock is on bottom, sling ring on barrel is on the right side. Entire gun is 42.5'' long. Can you tell me what I have? Recently given to me by my dad, who said it was his uncle's and brought back from France in WWII. It's in excellent condition. Where can I get the correct ammo for it and how much is it worth approximately? Thank you very much.

Christopher- The French military rifles seem to have had more repairs, upgrades, modfications and assorted fiddling than any other country except Turkey. I have never heard of a Model 1907 Berthier which was converted to 7.5mm, but then I usually stay far away from Frog firearms lest I be overcome with a desire to eat stinky cheese and wave white flags while wearing gaudy costumes. The Model 1907 was originally a very long rifle in 8mm Lebel caliber. The M34 MAS indicates it was modified in 1934 at MAS (St. Etienne). The 1936 on the barrel may reflect yet another change with that being the date the barrel was made. I am sure it is a collector prize for someone, but few French firearms seem to bring high prices. John Spangler

# 13900 - Arminius - Titan Tiger Value
Ralph -Chattanooga, TN

ARMINUS 38 Spl - Titan Tiger - 38 - 2 INCH - Blue - 38555 -

F.I.E. Corp. Miami, FLA Is this a German pistol & is it a good firing pistol? When Made. Worth any money

Ralph, references indicate that the Titan Tiger was a .38 special revolver with 2 or 4 inch barrel, fixed sights and blue or chrome finish that was marketed in the USA by FIE. Titan Tiger models with chrome finish were discontinued in 1984 and models with blue finish were discontinued in 1990.

Sorry to have to say that I am not a big fan of any of the Arminius firearms. In my opinion, they were cheaply made and of questionable safety. I would expect to see a Titan Tiger for sale at a gunshow in the $50 range. Marc

# 13899 - Gesichert Luger?

Gesichert - Luger - 9mm - Not sure - Don't Know - 6070 -

S/42 on top of slide I have this 1941 Luger with three stamps on the right side and an s/42 on the top I have done some research but can't find the s/42 mark any info would help with finding out what the worth could be

Jayshirlyny - Gesichert is the German word for safe, not the manufacturer of your Luger. This pistol is designed so that the word Gesichert is visible when the safety is in the on position, thus indicating that the safety is turned on and the pistol is "safe".

S/42 was a WW-II German ordnance code assigned to Mauser-Werke AG, Oberndorff am Neckar, Germany. It is found on Mauser manufactured Lugers that are dated from 1936 to 1939.

Lugers with the S/42 code should also have the following markings:

  • The serial number: stamped on the forward left side of the receiver, upper front of the frame, beneath the rear of the barrel, and on the base of the magazine.
    • The last two digits of the serial number should be stamped on most of the small parts.
  • S/42 stamped on the forward toggle:
  • The four digit year of manufacture-1936 through 1939 on the Receiver-above the chamber: .
  • The word GELADEN, meaning loaded and visible when a cartridge is in the chamber stamped on the left side of the extractor.
  • The bore size stamped beneath the rear of the barrel. This will be either 8.80, 8.81, 8.82, 8.83, or 8.84 millimeters.
  • Eagle over 63 military acceptance stamp stamped twice on the forward right side of the receiver, once on the top left side of the barrel one half inch from the receiver, and once on the base of the magazine.
  • Eagle, or eagle over swastika in a circle military test proof stamped on the forward right side of the receiver, the left side of the breech block, and the rear right side of the barrel.

Hope this helps, Marc

# 13808 - French Model 1886 Lebel With Dust Cover
Wes, Council Grove, KS

French Lebel - 1886 M93 - 8 MM - 32'' - Blue - MA 1 1889 -

Manufacture D` Arms Tulle This Lebel has an odd cover over the bolt, like a dust cover of sorts, which cycles with the bolt and apparently kept dirt and debris out of the action. I have never seen another Lebel with this cover. What is it? Does it make the rifle more rare? THX- WES

Wes- I have never seen or heard of a Lebel with a dust cover, but metal dust covers were somewhat popular during WW1, and can be found on German Gewehr 98 Mausers, and most Japanese rifle through WW2. In addition, canvas breech covers were made for U.S. Krag rifles, and also for British Lee Enfields. While this may be a rare variation, the only thing scarcer may be someone who desperately wants to buy one. John Spangler

# 13803 - Unusual Argentine Model 1891 Mauser

Mauser Loewe Berlin - Modelo Argentino 1891 - ?? - 29''?? - Blue - M 4735 -

Shield with wings I have a Mauser Modelo Argentino 1891 that I can't seem to find the information I am looking for about it. It has matching numbers stamped on the right side of it, on the barrel and receiver. Both of these numbers say M 4735. The bolt has a different number stamped on it. It is stamped W 3213. The bottom of the magazine is also stamped W 3213. The rifle has a metal emblem on the right side of it. This emblem looks to be some type of shield with wings. The barrel also seems like it is made for a bayonet. This rifle belonged to my grandfather and then I received it after my father passed away. I have searched for awhile now and although I can find information on Argentine 1891`s, I cannot seem to find anything out about this specific one. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Chris

Chris- Most of the Model 1891 Argentine Mausers saw little use, and are found in excellent condition with matching parts. It is not too unusual to find a bolt that has been switched and does not match, but to find the floorplate switched as well is pretty odd. The shield with wings is probably related to the Argentine Air Force, and maybe you can Google to find what their symbols look like and confirm that. The 1891 rifles were used by some military schools and honor guards even though they were obsolete for regular troops, so that may account for the mismatched parts and added insignia. John Spangler

# 13881 - Burgo Information
Dave, Savage, MN

Burgo - 108 - Kal. 32 S.u.W. Long - 69 Cm - Blue - 74349 -

From other comments on net it has an Eagle N, another symbol that looks like a basket (?), and a shield with 64 inside. Was wondering when it was made and where? Any other interesting points that may be available.

Dave, sorry to be the bearer of bad news. Burgo was an inexpensive (cheap Saturday night special type) revolver manufactured in the 1960's by Karl Burgsmuller of Kreiensen, West Germany for export to the United States. U.S. import of his type of revolver was banned by the gun control act of 1968. There is no collector demand for Burgo revolvers and values fall in the $25 to $50 range. Marc

# 13879 - Stainless Steel Winchester 1903?
Robert, Bartlett, TN

Winchester - 03 - 22 - 20 - Don`t Know - 39567 -

New Haven.CONN.Pat.Aug.27.01FEB.25.02.FEB.3.17.DEC.22.03. Behind the trigger is the number 8 stamped There are two stamps on the top of the barrel closest to the action that looks like PWT , and a I with what looks like an apostrophe to the upper right. What would the value be in good condition? I can`t really tell if it`s stainless, the metal does not have rust but there are little dimples in metal in some spots including the trigger guard and the end of the bore.

Robert, Winchester manufactured about 126,000 of their Model 1903 rifles between 1903 and 1932 when it was discontinued in favor of the Model 63. The little rifle was a semi-automatic, chambered in .22 Winchester Auto Rimfire with a 10 shot tubular magazine, 20 inch round barrel, open sights and a straight walnut grip stock which was cut out for partial magazine filling. The Winchester Model 1903 was never manufactured in stainless steel. If your rifle looks like it is made from stainless steel then my guess is that all of the finish is gone or that it has been chrome or nickel plated. I would expect to see a Winchester Model 1903 with no finish sell at a gunshow in the $200 to $250 range. Marc

# 13791 - M1 Garand Made By Winchester
Harold, Tulsa, Oklahoma

Winchester - M1 Garand - 30.06 - Don't Know - 1612002 -

Rifle is in excellent shape with normal wear ..At least in the 80 percentile of finish left. with patina on exposed metal. Rifle is very accurate. I would appreciate any info as to when it was made and any other info you may have. Thanks in advance for any response.

Harold- Your Garand was made around March 1945. Usually the barrels will had the month and year of manufacture stamped on the side (visible with the op rod pulled back) and that should be fairly close to the date of manufacture, unless the barrel was later replaced during an overhaul. We do not know of any source for further information about its history. John Spangler

# 13780 - Winchester Model 62A Serial Number

Winchester - 62A - 22 S, L Or LR - 22.5 Inches - Blue - 852937 -

The serial number on the stock is 852937. The serial number on the bottom of the rifle is 852937B I received this Winchester Model 62A from my father-in-law. He was born in 1929 and said he bought the gun when he was a teenager. The problem is everything I have found out is the serial numbers for the Model 62A only go through 409,000. The serial number on the stock is 852937, but the serial number on the underside of the gun is 852937B. It is stamped made in New Haven Conn Winchester Model 62A 22 S L OR LR on the barrel. It has an 8 inch pump handle with 17 groves. It looks identical to other Model 62As, but I am not sure what I really have. I found one auction sight that was auctioning a Model 62A with a serial number 852xxx, but it did not elaborate on the rifle. Thanks, Keith

Keith- Your research turns up the same info that I was able to find. My only explanation is that the serial number may look like 852,000 but actually be a poorly struck 352,000, or possibly a factory error where Bubba in the stamping department replaced a broken “3” with an “8” and it was used for a while until the boss caught the error. John Spangler

# 13877 - Marca Registhada Revolver?
Ted, Woodbridge, Virginia

Marca Registhada - 32 - 5'' - Blue - 19560 -

The handles have the manufacturer insignia and name molded into both sides of the handle - also, on the right side of the pistol is a stamped mark (cirular) - the pistol is double action, 5 shot and appears to be a 32 calibre Condition is fair - fully functioning - some slight pitting - otherwise not ''beat up'' I never heard of this manufacturer - where can I go to find out the history of the piece as well as the value

Ted, "Marca Registrada" is Spanish for "registered mark", it is the same thing as "trademark" in English. "Marca Registrada" would typically be printed on products that were intended for export. My guess is that you have one of the Spanish Smith and Wesson copies which are pretty common and were imported into the United States in the first half of the 20th century. There were several companies in Spain manufacturing this type of revolver during that time. Information about individual makers is often hard to find, without a brand or model name it is almost impossible.

Spanish Smith and Wesson copies have a reputation in general for making use of low quality, steel which may not be strong enough to handle modern day high- pressure loads. My advise would be to retire this weapon and not fire it. There is no collectors in the Spanish S&W copies, I often see revolvers in perfect condition being offered in the $50.00 range. Marc

# 13762 - Win. Mod. 1895 Musket- National Guard Colorado
Terry, Longview, wa.

Winchester - 1895 - .30 U.S. - 28 In. - Blue - 20192 -

2 B 43 on top of receiver, It is marked NATIONAL GUARD OF COLORADO on the right side of the receiver I recently purchased a 1895 win. musket that I want to restore to it's original state. Where can I get a full length forearm and the front barrel band for it? I believe it originally had a barrel band that is missing. The forearm had been cut back to just ahead of the rear barrel band. Condition is 75% to 80% blue, it is mechanically sound and very smooth action. Also what do you think the approximate value would be? Any help is greatly appreciated. Thank you.

Terry- Many of the lever action .30-40 caliber Model 1895 muskets with long barrels were later “sporterized” by owners who did not care about collecting guns, they just wanted something to slay innocent woodland creatures. I do not know of an source for original or reproduction forends or upper bands for the Model 1895 muskets. The upper bands are similar to Krag bands and one of those would look okay to most people.

The most common, or at least the most produced of the 1895 muskets was the 1916 version made for Russian contracts in 7.62 x 54mmR caliber, with striper clip guides added to the receiver. About 293,000 of those were made, but considering the large number they are not encountered very often. The U.S. Army purchased 10,000 Model 1895 muskets in .30-40 caliber with 28 inch barrels in 1898, but they were delivered too late for use in the Spanish-American War. 100 of those were sent to the 33rd Volunteer Infantry for trial sin the Philippines, where they were not well liked, compared to the Krags, mainly due to their demanding more careful loading of the cartridges. Those 100 rifles were returned and sold off as surplus. The remaining 9,900 were sold to M. Hartley in 1906 and ended up in Mexico (or Cuba, according to some people). In any case, the U.S. marked muskets are seldom seen and usually in incredibly bad condition. Winchester also made sopme “NRA Model” muskets with 24 or 30 inch barrels in .30-40, .30-03 or .30-06 caliber for competition shooting. Finally, the state of Colorado purchased a number (maybe 500 or1,000) of these for use by their National Guard. This may have been a deal where they were paid for by federal money, which would account for the K.S.M. inspector markings found on them, while straight commercial production guns were not inspected by federal inspectors.

As far as value, it is hard to say with the boogered stock and missing parts. As a shooter, perhaps something like $750-1000, but this is one where a willing buyer and willing seller need to sit down and reach an agreement.

We answered a similar question back in 2003 as question number 5224 and that may have some additional info. John Spangler

# 13866 - Ortgies Value

Ortgies - 7.65mm/ 32ACP - Blue - 9778 -

Left side states ''Ortgies & Co- Erfurt'' Ortgies` Patent This gun has the HO bronze medallion and also shows the Erfurt location. The serial number would indicate that this is a gun that was made by Heir Ortgies. The gun is in 90%- 95% condition with the holster not fairing so well at 40%. Does anyone know the value and manufacture date of this gun? It's a beauty and I would like to know more about it.

Kristi, it looks like you have really done your homework on Ortgies pistols. There is no serial number information that I have been able to find that would tell us when your pistol was manufactured. The best that I can tell you is that the .32 caliber models were made between 1920 and 1928.

Although Ortgies pistols are well made, there is not allot of collectors in them, so value is not very high. I would expect to see a pistol like the one you are describing sell at a gunshow in the $300 or less range. Marc

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