# 1398 - Colt New Service Revolvers
8/29/98
Bruce, Coldwater, Ont.

Could you supply a little information about the following Colt New Service Revolvers:1) New Service - 45 Colt - #3060572) New Service - 45 Colt - #3063433) New Service - 455 Eley - #71157Thank You, Bruce

Answer:
Bruce- The two serial numbers for the .45 Colt New Service models are outside the known range for this model, so we cannot tell you anything about them. Serial number 71157 was made in 1902. The .455 caliber revolvers went mainly to British or Canadian buyers. The North West Mounted Police bout about 1,000 of these but most appear in the range 115,000-140,000. Perhaps the Colt factory records could provide more information. I am not sure what their fee is for research but believe it is about $75 per number. Our rates are consistent with what we provide... John Spangler

# 1395 - Springfield M1903 Receiver Hole
8/29/98
Jerry

I have a 1903a3 Springfield that has a small hole drilled in side of receiver, it is not into chamber but up close to front of boltface. Could you tell me what the hole was drilled for. Thank you

Answer:
Jerry- Sometimes holes in rifle receivers are the result of wannabe gunsmiths with a 1/4 inch Black and Decker and a box of bits (really tough bits if playing with a M1903A3.). However, all M1903 Springfields were made with a small hole on the right side of the receiver (on the side of the boxy part under where the serial number is), that lined up with a small hole in the front of the extractor. In theory if a cartridge case ruptured, the gas pressure would escape out the hole without damaging the rifle or shooter. By 1936 it was decided that this hole was not large enough, and a large hole was made in the bottom of the bolt (less than an inch from the face) and a hole about 1/4 inch diameter drilled in the left side of the receiver opposite the small hole initially used. This was supposed to be added to rifles when overhauled, but completion of this seems to have been erratic. When the M1903A3 was developed they kept the larger hole, and eliminated the smaller one on the right as unnecessary, along with the small hole in the front of the extractor. Now you know!... John Spangler

# 1374 - "Texas Ranger" Pistol
8/29/98
G. R./Dallas, Texas/USA

There are no markings on this very pretty, little gun. As noted, the frame and hammer are brass, the cylinder and barrel are blue. It looks exactly like a Colt SAA in miniature, and the top of the barrel is marked Texas Ranger .38 Smith & Wesson. If I had it in front of me I could be more precise. The loading gate is on the right! The gun can be fired double action! The grips appear to be some kind of smooth polished bone, almost like pearlized but, of course, they could be some kind of synthetic. There was a small, knurled piece under the barrel that was unusual. The rest was typical of a Frontier type/SAA model, at least externally. Due to the lack of a manufacturer's name, there is no other indication of who, what, when, or where. Can you identify this gun, who made it, when, where, etc., and can you guess at a value?

Answer:
G.R.- "Texas Ranger" was a house brand name used by Montgomery Ward for imported revolvers and shotguns according to Frank Seller "American Gunsmiths". I have no idea when, but probably early 20th century or sometime after the 1950s when single actions started to get popular again... John Spangler

# 1443 - Beretta 70 Series Pistols
8/25/98
Max, Winfield, WV, USA

Gardone V.T. Do you have, or know where to get, any technical information available? How old is it? I would like to know how to break it down for cleaning. TIA

Answer:
The Beretta Model 70 is a blowback operated pistol with an aluminum alloy receiver. The first Beretta 70 series models were introduced in 1958, they replaced Beretta Models 1935 and 948. The 70 series use a cross-bolt safety which blocks the hammer and sear with the pistol fully cocked. The trigger linkage was improved and a push-button type magazine release is incorporated. To field strip The 70 series pistols: Remove magazine by depressing magazine catch on the left bottom of grip. Draw slide to the rear and align the dismounting latch on the right side of the slide with the dismounting notch on the slide. Push the dismounting latch upward toward the muzzle-end of the arm. Pull the slide group forward and off the receiver. Pull the recoil spring and guide assembly slightly to the rear and upward, removing it from the slide. Push barrel backward and withdraw it from the slide... Marc

# 1367 - M1903A3 (1903A4) Remington Rifle
8/25/98
Mark

My dad passed away last year and left me the above mentioned rifle. It has scope mounted on it...M-82 (I believe government issue). I was wondering what type of rifle this was...i.e. sniper, etc. There is 9-43 stamped on barrel, is this the manufacture date. Also, Is this rifle valuable, and can I trace who it was originally issued to. My dad was in WWII, Korea and Vietnam....I was wondering if it may have been his rifle???

Answer:
Mark- Although marked on the left side of the receiver "U.S./Remington/Model 03-A3" this is in fact a Model 1903A4 Sniper rifle. Note that the markings can be read with the scope base in place, while the regular M1903A3 markings are centered on the top of the receiver and would be hidden by the base. None were originally marked 03A4 although some had the marking altered later, probably during overhaul. Barrel dates are usually pretty closes to the time of manufacture, with most being 3-43 in the first and largest batch of about 20,000 rifles in the low 3.4 million range. The later 4.99 million range and Z prefix 4.00 million range added about 8,000 more for a total production of about 28,000 rifles, or about the same as the total number of M1903 and M1903A1 National Match rifles made. The M73B1 (GI version of the Weaver 330C), M81 and M82 (GI variants of the Lyman Alaskan) and the M84 telescopes were all issued with the M1903A4 rifles at various times. They will also be found with full pistol grip "C" stocks although most seem to have originally had the ugly "scant" or "semi-pistol grip" stocks. I do not think you will be able to track this down through any official records. Some of the rifles were still in National Guard inventories as late as Vietnam. I doubt very much if this was a rifle issued to your dad. It is possible it was sold to him as surplus by the Army. (I have seen one still in the cosmoline in a box with sales documents from Okinawa dated late 1945). Many were later sold through the NRA and the Director of Civilian Marksmanship program, often without scopes, and sometimes without bases. Some owners just put on regular M1903A3 rear sights, or commercial Redfield Junior bases and mounts and went looking for deer. I have been able to find and restore about 8 of these over the years. Interest in M1903A4s will surely jump with the popularity of "Saving Private Ryan" which has a character using one of these. Just ignore the parts where they change scopes for long and short range shooting. Pure Hollywood BS without any basis in fact. Lately I have seen people asking $1500 for these rifles, and some greedy or incredibly optimistic souls have asked a lot more... John Spangler

# 1363 - Stevens Crack Shot Rifle
8/25/98
Dave Auburn CA USA

Top of barrel in front of the rear sight says 22-LONG RIFLE, behind the fixed sight says *Crack Shot*, then it says J. Stevens Arms & Tool Co.Chicopee Falls Mass. U.S.A. Pat App"d For Stamped on the grip area, T 484 This is an old single shot 22, two position hammer, that has been in the family for a long time. It looks like one of the Steven Jr. models you have described before, but I haven't seen you refer to the Crack Shot model. Any ideas on vintage? I plan to keep it for a display piece. Thanks for the help.

Answer:
Dave- Stevens had many different "boys rifles" and the "Crack Shot No. 15" was one of them. It was produced from 1900 to 1939 and available in .22, .25, .32, .38 and .44 long (all rimfire cartridges). Normal barrel lengths were 24, 26, 28, and 30 inches, but others could be had, and many were undoubtedly shortened later. I suspect yours is a fairly early one with the Patent applied for marking. Neat old guns. Not banned yet, but that must just be an oversight... John Spangler

# 1430 - Western Field No.47C Manufacturer
8/22/98
Tom Tampa Fl

Who manufactured this gun for Wards? It is at least 34 years old and has no visible serial no. It came with Mossberg 3 point site. (Mossberg No.4 stamped on rear site.) Any info. appreciated.

Answer:
Tom, my records indicate that the Western Field Model 47A - L is the Mossberg model 45A... Marc

# 1384 - 1914 or 1934 Mauser?
8/22/98
Bob, Quilcene, WA, USA

Right of slide - MAUSER 7,65. Left of slide WAFFENFABRIK MAAUSER A-G OBERNDORF A.N. MAUSER'S PATENT Left on frame has Mauser banner How do you tell a 1914 from a 1934? Anymore info like Blocks of Serial Numbers or whatever. Thanks,

Answer:
Bob, there is not much difference between the 1914 and the 1934 Mauser, the easiest way to tell the two apart, is the difference in the grips. Model 1934 grips are one piece and wrap around the grip frame... Marc

# 1358 - U.S. Model 1906 Cavalry Sabre
8/22/98
Bill, Round Rock, TX, USA,

Ser.# above is on bottom of hand guard. Top right side Blade, A.S.Co., Flaming Ball symbol, 1906 Foot of sheath has initials ":E.W." or ":F.W." I got this sword shortly after WWII in San Antonio, at the old original Buckhorn Saloon. There were two wooden barrels, one with swords and the other sheaths. I assume they were from Fort Sam Houston. The blade has no rust, The grip is leather with a gold color wire wrap, and the sheath has only a little discoloration. I got this sword after WWII at the original Buckhorn Saloon in San Antonio. There were two barrels, one with swords and one with sheaths. Can you tell me the Mfg. and any collector value?

Answer:
Bill- Guess I hang around in the wrong saloons. The ones I visit hardly have bathrooms let alone luxuries like barrels of swords. By 1906 the supply of Model 1860 light cavalry sabres left over from the Civil War was exhausted. Ames Sword Company got a contract to make 20,000 more virtually identical to the Civil War pattern except for use of iron instead of brass for the guards, and of course, different makers markings. The scabbards were slightly different, with the rings for the suspension straps noticeably closer together than on the M1860. Before the contract was complete, the army decided that a straight blade and different hilt would be a better idea, so they got Ames to deliver 1,039 "Experimental Model 1906" swords as part of that contract. As a result only 18,961 of the curved blade older pattern were delivered. The experimental swords are very valuable, and the regular 1906 models seem to run somewhat less than the Civil War versions, so maybe $250-450 depending on condition. The 303 A 18 markings are not a serial number but unit markings. One number (usually the first which is also usually a small number) indicating the Regiment, then a letter for the Troop (if cavalry, Company for other branches) and another number assigned to an individual. The initials are probably those of an inspector... John Spangler

# 1327 - Muzzle Loader I. Hollis & Son
8/22/98
Matt, Brenham, Texas,

This is a percussion, smooth bore, with a manufacturer's mark that says "Makers to Her Majesty's War Dept", with an I, J, and H intertwined together, the forearm of the stock goes all the way to the end of the barrel, the buttplate is brass, and on the left side of the stock,(at the part that holds the trigger and hammer mechanism), is a brass seasnake or dragon about 6 inches long. What is the age of this gun, who used it(army, navy, etc), and was it something that might have been sold to Confederate forces? What caliber is this? Also, any idea as to value? (Is missing the ramrod). Thanks!

Answer:
Matt- Isaac Hollis & Sons operated in London England from 1862 to 1900. While they may have made military arms, the one you have was not used by the army or the navy, and almost certainly not by any Confederate forces. The "seasnake" or dragon plate opposite the lock is a feature that is almost always found on "Trade Rifles" made for the Hudson's Bay Company to be sold in Canada or traded to the natives for furs. These guns usually also have a somewhat exaggerated trigger guard, and the brass mountings are common. Bore sizes run fairly large (5/8 inch is about .62 caliber). The same basic style rifle was made for almost all of the 19th century, the earliest being flintlocks and the later ones percussion, continuing well into the cartridge period. Yours sounds like one of the very late ones. I am sure there would be collector interest, but probably little in Texas. Without seeing it we cannot do much on the value, but probably somewhere in the $200-600 range depending on condition... John Spangler

# 1446 - Stevens "Boys' Rifles"
8/18/98
Fred

Details I've found on the gun: J. STEVENS A&T CHICOPEE FALLS MASS U.S.A. PAT APR Model no: 52312, It's approx. length is 35" and it's condition-fair. I have an old rifle that I believe may be from the turn of the century. Can you help me to determine the value and possible collectors that could be interested in it?

Answer:
Fred- Thanks for contacting Antique and Collectable Firearms and Militaria Headquarters. Stevens made many different models around 1890-1920, most of them being inexpensive "Boys' rifles" with values in the $75-150 range in fair condition, and very weak demand in that condition. An exception would be if it is a heavy barrel target model, and they are worth a lot more. We would need some good close up photos to identify the exact model. You can send them to us at Box 711282, Salt Lake City, UT 84171. We appreciate your offering us these items, but we will pass on them at this time. These usually sell well in antique stores where they get excited about "old" and don't care much about model or condition. You might also walk it through a local gun show and see if anyone is interested. There are a number of good ones in Virginia, including Richmond, VA Beach, Roanoke. Please let us know if any other items become available... John

# 1445 - Ammo Identification
8/18/98

I hope that you can tell me what this ammo is that I have acquired. It is headstamped "fa 41" (Frankfort arsenal 1941) and is in a brown cardboard box with a red strip down the front on a paper label. The box reads "20 cartridges ball/caliber .30 m1/ammunition lot f.A. 2160". The strange thing is that the bullet is silver tip painted. Is this an early tracer round? Why does it say ball on the box and not tracer. Thanks

Answer:
Chip-After M2 Ball was standardized in 1939-40, Ball M1 was made limited standard, except for use in US Navy aircraft machine guns. (Reason unknown for this). "One of the last lots of M1 Ball cartridges manufactured at Frankford Arsenal was lot 2160 (accepted September 3, 1941), loaded for the Navy. To distinguish this ammunition from M2 Ball (the stannic staining of the M2 Ball bullet having ceased in September 1940 [Previously used to distinguish it from the then-standard M1 Ball]), the tips of the bullets were silver colored. This lot consisted of 1,011,000 rounds and was loaded with R.O.W. (Radford Ordnance Works) powder. Headstamp used was FA 41." [Following paragraph states the last lot of M1 Ball was Lot 2161 accepted October 24, 1941.) Silver or aluminum color tips were later used on U.S. .30 and .50 caliber ammunition to indicate Armor Piercing Incendiary ammunition. Tracer was either red or orange. Chip, if you are excited by such trivia you really should invest in Hackley Woodin & Scranton's History of US Military Small Arms Ammunition, 2 vols (1880-1940 and 1940-45). It will make you look as smart as me if somebody asks you a question like this... John Spangler

# 1438 - Wesson & Harring Pistol
8/18/98
Keith

I have a pistol & I don't know what it is, I received it from my grandfather who got it from his father. It is small & has the words wesson & harring on it. Could you tell me what it is?

Answer:
Keith- Frank Wesson made a variety of firearms in the pre-Civil War period. For about 6 months in 1859 he was in a partnership with Nathan Harrington to manufacture single shot .22 rimfire pistols with a brass frame. Production is believed to be about 100 total, making them scarce. However, there are not many folks who collect Wesson stuff or Harrington & Richardson items (the firm in which the Harrington family was later involved.) Flayderman's guide lists a value of $475 in NRA antique good, and $900 in NRA antique fine. Pretty good for what was originally an inexpensive pistol, but probably one that would be slow to sell. Let us know if you are interested in selling, we would be glad to handle it on a consignment basis... John

# 1437 - Gun Show Lists
8/15/98
Robert

Dear sir, Could you please e-mail me a list of gun shows in the Pennsylvania and New Jersey area? I would appreciate your help. Thank you! Robert

Answer:
Robert- We do not have a complete list of gun shows, although we do have a section where promoters are welcome to post their shows FREE. We have experience with some shows and have heard reputations of some others, and are sometimes able to recommend specific shows if people have a specific interest. In my opinion some of the best shows in the country include: MD Arms Collectors, Baltimore (actually Timonium) in March (post 1898 handguns prohibited); the Colorado Gun Collectors in May (best displays in the country on wide variety of arms topics), and the Big Reno Show (formerly Shotgun News show) several times a year. Others in the top grouping include the Ohio Gun Collectors in Cleveland several times a year (open to members and invited guests only); Wally Beinfeld's Las Vegas shows (for the folks into high dollar stuff); PA Antique Gun Collectors Assn, Pottstown PA; Great Southern Arms Show in Richmond, VA; Missouri Valley Arms Collectors Kansas City, MO; and the BIG show in Tulsa, OK. Add the Springfield, MA show at the "Big "E"; and the Great Western in Pasadena (recent change in management may reverse its declining trend although that may be driven more by harassment by California officials.) Any show sponsored by a real Gun Collectors group is usually pretty good, though often small: Utah Gun Collectors in Ogden, UT; Wyoming Weapons Collectors in Riverton, WY; Montana Weapons Collectors in Missoula, MT and some other towns; PA Gun Collectors in Greesnburg, PA; Alabama Gun Collectors in Birmingham, AL; and probably others I have forgotten. I have found some real treasures at big shows, and also at tiny ones, and met some really nice people with similar interests. I like the shows with older guns for collectors, and others like shows that have more modern guns for the shooter. The earliest piece in my collection, a M1795 Springfield musket dated 1799 (first year they marked them) and another 1795 Springfield were purchased at a small show in Delaware from a dealer in modern handguns. He was glad to get rid of these two ugly old long guns, and I was, well, delighted too. The most complete info on Gun Show dates is in the Gun Show Calendar, put out by the Gun List people. Shotgun News also has a good list of show dates and advertising. A smaller list is in Gun Report and Man at Arms. Several promoters have web sites with info on their shows. We do not have the time or inclination to attempt to keep a complete show listing posted. Again, if promoters don't post their shows, some people won't find out about them. Hope this helps. Take the family or someone who has never been to a gun show when you go... John

# 1436 - Italian Folding Bayonet
8/15/98
Ernie

Ran across your web page and was wondering if you had heard of the knife I own. My understanding is that it is WWI. It is a folding bayonet. Blade is about 9" long and handle is about 4" long. (Guesstimate since I don't have it in front of me as I write this). To us, has a button near hinge point. Push button, grab blade with one hand, handle with other and pull out. Blade will then fold (like a jack knife). Push blade up to lock. Reverse procedure to open. Looks like would be good hand to hand weapon when folded. Also would stow easily. Has wooden handles in like new condition. Blade originally blued (or "browned" more accurately), and original coloration has been scraped off at one point or another. Otherwise in mint condition. No specific markings on knife anywhere as I recall...I'll have to look closer at it tonight. At any rate, I have never seen another like it. It is definitely factory made and has the hole/opening for the rifle barrel...so I know it is a bayonet. I am interested in finding out just what it is. So, if you have ever heard of something like this, I would appreciate hearing about it. Thanks Ernie

Answer:
Ernie- This is the Italian Model 1938 folding bayonet for use on the Carcano rifles. These are interesting oddities for the collector. They are not real common, but not uncommon either. We have sold two in the last year or so. The color on the various parts usually runs between blue and a purplish-brownish color. These didn't last too long and the Italians returned to a standard fixed bayonet... Enjoy. John

# 1435 - Kaiser Wilhelm I Shotgun?
8/15/98
Jim, Oldsmar, FL

I have a fine double barreled percussion shotgun, with silver inlays, carved burl stock, engraving, German silver fittings, made by F. Mundt in Neuweddell that according to family history belonged to Kaiser Wilhelm I when he was King of Prussia. In 1861 the king fell of his horse while hunting, landed on the gun and shot himself in the leg. He gave the pieces to his guide who wired it together and took it to the US 5 years later. Except for the stock the gun has been kept in excellent condition, no pitting and almost no rust. I had the broken part of the stock professionally restored to prevent further deterioration. I would dearly like to track down the German history of this gun, verify that Wilhelm had an accident at that time, learn more about the gunsmith, etc. Do you know anyone who can help me? Thanks.

Answer:
Jim- Sounds like a nice old gun and an even greater story. However, I think the story will be nearly impossible to verify. I would suggest that whoever knows the family tradition write it down, including a detailed description of the gun. Get it notarized. Get some good photos of the gun to go with it. Then you will have to look for biographies of Wilhelm, most of which will probably be written in German. Take a few minutes to learn the read German and see what they tell you. If you find more about the story such as a date and location, then see if Allied bombers permitted any copies of the local newspapers to survive, or if they are available on microfilm somewhere. Of course, since you can read German now, it won't take long to see if there is any coverage in the local papers. Then comes the hard part, proving that this is the gun involved. That may be impossible unless the paper reports something that (translated) goes like this "His Highness, in a typical generous gesture of gratitude, summoned his faithful guide Fritz von Poachenberg, known to his friends as "Gunny." Wilhelm, despite his considerable pain and bloodshed, presented the double barreled percussion shotgun, with silver inlays, carved burl stock, engraving, German silver fittings, made by F. Mundt in Neuweddell to Fritz. The humble guide, with tears of gratitude rolling down his beard, proclaimed to all that he would wrap wire around the broken stock and take the gun with him to America when he emigrated in the future and see that his family kept it forever." I must caution everyone that family traditions often contain an element of truth that has been mixed with other information, and possibly some facts lost over the years. Thus a .45-70 rifle made in 1880 appears with a story of having been carried by an ancestor in the Revolutionary War. More accurately it may be that "Great-great Grandpa Jones, who fought in the revolution carried a rifle. His grandson fought in the Civil War and also carried a rifle. Grandpa Smith bought this rifle from Bannerman's in 1940 and wanted you to have it." Well, Aunt Matilda was a little old, hard of hearing, and took lots of medicine. She got the stories confused when she gave Jim-Bob the gun a few years ago, or Jim-Bob who was 12 at the time really was not paying much attention and got it mixed up. Who knows Concerning German gunsmiths: There is a German language book (actually 3 volumes) listing gun makers, "Die Neue Stockel" (or close to that) which may be helpful. This is a scarce set, and priced at several hundred dollars. I just learned that George Hoyem will be publishing "The Golden Age of German and Austrian Gun Makers" later this year, covering Pre-WW2 makers. This may be an excellent resource for the many fine doubles and drilling, vierlings, etc brought back as souvenirs following WW2. George Hoyem is an expert on cartridges and has devoted much of his life to publishing and reprinting superb reference books for gun and ammunition collectors. I urge everyone to support his efforts by purchasing any of his books that even remotely touch on areas they are interested in... John Spangler

# 1434 - Stevens Model 35
8/11/98

I have a 410 pistol made by Stevens arms company located in chiopce falls mass..the numbers I found on it are 17\2\57. it has a 12" barrel the chamber has the octagon part. the handle is wooden, it looks like it is all original I am looking for information on this pistol can you help me. thank you

Answer:
Sir- Thanks for contacting us. You probably have the Stevens Model 35 pistol. These were available in .410 gauge with 8 inch or 12.25 inch barrels from 1923 to 1929. A slightly different version was made from 1929 to 1934. These were banned under the 1934 National Firearms Act as "sawed off shotguns" which obviously would thereafter only be of interest to low life criminal scum gangsters. Banning them would make the streets safe, the sun shine, and taxes go down. (Or something like that). However, they could be legally owned if the owner registered them and paid a $5.00 transfer tax. I think they could also be registered during a brief "amnesty period" in 1968. If not registered (and you should have papers from BATF to prove it), they are illegal to own or possess. There is no way to legally register them now. The same basic information also applies to machine guns.. There are several options. We recommend you call BATF (see govt pages of your phone book for number) and tell them you found this and want to turn it in for destruction. Other people might suggest that you destroy it yourself (big hammer or cutting torch) and dispose of the pieces. Still other people might suggest replacing the barrel with a rifled one, or adding an extension to the barrel to make it at least 18 inches long and the overall length of the whole gun 25 or 26 inches. This whole approach is just an example of the "reasonable compromise" that anti-gun people keep using. Pick some sort of gun they don't like (any will do) blame it for causing crime, and restrict or prohibit ownership so "the children will be safe." Impact on criminals is about zero every time (despite big promises) and then they claim that just one more reasonable compromise with bans or restrictions on another type of gun will make the streets safe, the sun shine, and taxes go down for sure this time. Well, they got machine guns, and sawed off shotguns, and assault weapons, and large capacity feeding devices (all very broadly defined.) They are looking next at anything semi-automatic (even though they don't have a clue what that means.). After that, probably "sniper rifles" with telescopes, shotguns that COULD be sawed off, easily concealable handguns (less than 15 pounds or 48 inches long) and "quiet" .22 caliber guns, and any type of ammunition. Blackpowder replicas and antiques (military arms when the Constitution was written) can still kill and must be eliminated too. Maybe a small compromise to just register them, or keep them locked up in an approved container, or at an approved sporting club first. Then we can have them all confiscated later. Sound like BS? Sounds more like Sarah Brady, Chuck Shumer, Di Feinstein, Ted Kennedy, Bill Clinton and some of your local political hacks. Hope you are listening and fighting NOW. Why not remove the existing restrictions if they don't do what was promised? By the way, we sure would appreciate it if everyone who submits a questions (or even if you just like to read them) send us a check made out to NRA-ILA to help protect your gun rights. Send to Box 711282, Salt Lake City, UT 84171)... John Spangler

# 1421 - Bayonet Identification
8/11/98
Art

I have a German bayonet and scabbard in excellent condition dated 1920 stamped on it. The manufacturer was A.G.Duisburg. Above the name it is stamped Deulsche Maschinenfairik. Has a V shaped notch in the end of the hilt and the groove for attaching to a rifle has been plugged. when or how I don`t know. I am interested in its approximate value. Thank You Art

Answer:
Art- "Bayonets from Janzen's Notebook" shows several examples on pages 98-99 of 1920 marked bayonets, or ones dated to 1920 by other means. He notes "These dates show they have been inventoried under the terms of the Versailles Treaty." One example of the "butcher" pattern has a note that "Some of the issued pieces were rendered nonfunctional by cutting a notch in the pommel." Besides standard bayonets, the Germans used dress, or "walking out" bayonets that were nickel plated and fancy, but not really intended for combat use, some even lack the means to fit on a rifle. They also had a variety of bayonets and knives similar to bayonets used by police and para-military outfits (equivalent to our own increasingly armed and militarized Forest Service, National Park Rangers, BLM agents,etc) mainly as insignia of rank or for dress occasions. I suspect your bayonet would have little interest from collectors looking for representative combat examples, but specialists would think it is a wonderful treasure. Check our links page for the one that specializes in German bayonets, and you can probably find out more from them, or advertise it there to get it a good home... John

# 1420 - Model 1841 "Mississippi" Rifle
8/11/98
Mike

My father passed down a rifle/musket that has Whitney 1852 inscribed on it. It has a brass plate on the stock that swings open and contains what look like 2 large rounds of ammo. He found it when he was a kid near Cold Harbor Va. It is in great condition. Any information you have concerning this weapon or its' value would be appreciated.

Answer:
Mike- This is one of 26,500 Model 1841 "Mississippi" rifles made by Whitney under four contracts between 1843 and 1855. They were originally .54 caliber (although many were rebored to .58 caliber for use in the Civil War.) They originally had two bradd bands holding the barrel and stock together. After the war, some had the stocks cut down and the barrels reamed out smooth for use as cheap shotguns. Undoubtedly hundreds of these rifles were used during both the first and second battles at Cold Harbor, and many left on the battlefield or abandoned in the woods. Nice heirloom with an interesting story. Incidentally, Second Cold Harbor was the only known combat use of the U.S. Model 1863 "Lindsay Double Musket" that used a single .58 caliber muzzle loading barrel but had two hammers and two nipples. You could load two charges in the barrel, pull the trigger and (hopefully only) fire the front charge, then pull again to fire the rear charge. A very innovative design, not invented by the Ordnance Department. Proof that those who criticize the Ordnance Department for stupidity and unwillingness to change are wrong. (That is a polite way of saying W.H. Hallahan's Book "Misfire" lacks a lot of credibility.) John

# 1419 - 1851 Colt Navy Percussion Identification
8/8/98
Jason

1851 Colt Navy Percussion Ball/Cap .36 caliber 7.5 inches Blued Barrel Case hardened trigger and upper frame Trigger guard is silver in color, possibly coated over a brass frame Walnut one piece grip Cylinder is engraved with the ship battle scene Barrel is blued with small brass bead front sight, and stamped as follows- ADDRESS SAML COLT NEW-YORK CITY , all words are on one line stamped directly across the top of the barrel starting 1/3 of the way back from the front to the rear of the barrel. COLTS PATENT is stamped on the left side of the trigger guard, and about 3/4 of an inch towards the front, the word COLTS is centered directly above the word PATENT. The serial number is 5123 and is present on all the parts, wedge, cylinder, frame, barrel, spindle, trigger guard. The trigger guard is square and there are approximetly 6 screws in the piece, two above the grip, one if front of the trigger guard, two behind the trigger guard, and one on the bottom of the grip directly in front of a stamped serial number. My question is that if this is a replica or a true original, and what is its value if one or the other. I have done much research and visited many gun shops with no positive results, please help me.

Answer:
The details you describe on your Model 1851 Colt Navy .36 caliber percussion revolver are consistent in most respects with an early authentic piece. The serial number places the date of manufacture as 1851. The markings are correct, including the New York barrel address. The finish, including silver plated brass guard and backstrap, is correct. However, the trigger guard is out of the ordinary. The early Model 1851s used a square back trigger guard, and this was phased out by about serial number 4200, although a few are known as high as 4500. These "square back" versions are desirable variants, and a number have been faked over the years. It is possible that (a) your whole gun is a reproduction, or (b) that the trigger guard has been altered on an otherwise original revolver, or (c) that it is an example of a gun with "out of range" features. It is also possible that I have misinterpreted your description of the trigger guard and that it is in fact the normal small oval trigger guard expected for a gun in the 5100 serial number range. Value of a reproduction is in the $150-350 range depending on maker, workmanship, and condition. Value of an original second model squareback is listed in Flayderman's Guide at $2,750 in NRA antique Good, and $15,000 in NRA antique Fine. For a third model with small oval guard the value is listed at $750 in NRA antique Good, and $3,500 in NRA antique Fine... John

# 1418 - Old Sword Identification
8/8/98
Joe

Hello. My name is Joe, and I've got a sword which I think you may be interested in. I've done a fair amount of research to determine exactly the type of sword I have. I think I've narrowed it down to either a Calvary Officer's Saber, a Union Light Calvary Saber, or a Confederate Foot Officer's Saber. At any rate, I'll describe it for you. It has 3 letters stamped on the left side of the brass handle. It looks like F S(with a star under it) and wither an 8 or a B. After that, there is 1200 stamped on it. On the blade itself, it has -- K B L stamped on the right side close to the handle, and on the top of the blade, again close to the handle, fancy hand engraved script (in French I think), followed by what appears to be Klingerthal Janview, and a date of 1814. The word's sheath is metal as well, with two circular hooks (presumably to hook onto a horse's saddle) It is a straight sword. (I say this because some of the examples I've seen are similar to mine, however, they have an arch to them) Please, please tell me something about this sword. I'd be curious to know what you think it is, its origin, some history about it, and of course, what you presume is the value of something like this. It is in pretty good shape for something that's 184 years old!!! It has a pretty good patina, and the leather handle with braided brass rope is not too bad as well. 97% of the leather is still in tact, as well as 100% of the brass rope. Thanks for reading this rambling note -- I look forward to your reply --Thanks a million, Joe

Answer:
Joe- I can only say for sure that is an old sword with a straight blade, writing on the top of the blade perhaps with a date of 1814, and a metal scabbard. This does not sound like either a U.S. or Confederate sword. Markings on the top of the blade were most commonly used by the French throughout the 19th century, but possibly by other European countries, and occasionally even by US makers in the very early 1800s. The other markings don't help much, but may be Austrian or from somewhere else in that neighborhood. For any sort of sword identification we really need photos to be much help. Send some to us at Box 711282, Salt Lake City, UT and we will see if we can do better. Value of "an old sword" may be well under $100 or several times that depending on model and condition. John Spangler

# 1416 - Moore And Grey Shotgun
8/8/98
Terry

The name, "William Moore & Grey, 43 Old Bond Street, London" is engraved on it, along with serial number 2116. It is estimated to be approximately 120 years old, it is a double barrel muzzle loader/black powder gun with dual hammer/dual trigger. It is a Damascus barrel and in very good condition, according to the gunsmith who looked at it. I cannot locate anything on this company; would you be able to provide any information, or possibly point me in the right direction? I greatly appreciate your help. Thank you so much!

Answer:
Terry- Moore and Grey operated from1850 to 1930 at various locations. Gardner's "Small Arms Makers" lists a beginning and ending address for them but neither is the Bond Street address on your gun. Value on these is tough to predict. For comparison, I saw a beautiful English double barrel percussion 16 GA shotgun last week in Denver. About 98% finish, high quality work, in the original case, etc. It was priced at $5,000 by a dealer who I know tends to be a little on the high side. Without a case, and showing any wear at all, the price on yours would probably not even approach half of that. For someone looking for a "shooter" the price may be as low as a few hundred dollars. You really need to have it examined by an expert in the old shotgun field, and even then it may be very difficult to sell as there is not a lot of interest in these unless in exceptional condition or as shooters. Hope this helps... John

# 1403 - US Win Trench Gun WB Cartouche
8/4/98
Toshiba User

You list serial as 974,474 and say that it has a WB cartouche. I have a win. Trench gun ser.943,752 also with a WB cartouche. I have a book, US Win. Trench and Riot guns by Joe Poyer in which it states that no trench or riot gun with a WB cartouche has been found with a serial above 926,809. After that it is GHD. He indicates that any guns found otherwise should be looked at with suspicion. Can you shed any light on this?

Answer:
Sir- I have a problem with Poyer's books and all his "always/never" type assertions. However, it is good to be suspicious with all trench/riot guns, as the fakers are busy. I have no doubt that the WB cartouche on my example is authentic and original, based on comparison with others I have seen, overall condition, and circumstances of its purchase. Poyer may not have seen any above the number he cites, and I respect him for listing the limit of what he had seen. I have never met him, and don't know how extensive his database might be. so his sample frequency may be large or small. In reality, Winchester and other makers in WW2 rarely shipped in exact, or even close serial number sequences, so "out of range" items abound. Actual inspection and stamping of cartouches was done by flunkies on the line, not by Col. Broberg or Col Drewry, and shift to stamps with new initials may not have been timely, and it is possible that the old stamps were inadvertently used at times after the new were available. I have seen a M1903 Springfield made in 1905, absolutely correct and original in every detail, purchased by one of the most knowledgeable collector/dealers in the field that was cartouched with inspector initials and date that are theoretically impossible (JSA 1899). Unusual, yes, but real! US Martial shotgun literature is sparse. In my opinion, the best work remains Eric Archer's article in the 1988 Gun Digest. He had a book nearly ready for publication but his manuscript, computer files, research notes, and collection were destroyed in a tragic fire about 6 years ago. (His whole house and most of the neighborhood went up in smoke too, but we only grieve for the important stuff). Poyer's book is next best, except for the "always/never" aspect, and I think some of his marking drawings are incorrect. Canfield's U.S. Infantry Weapons of WW2 is excellent, but limited to WW2. Canfield's U.S. Martial Shotguns has superb photos and good appendices. He did some good research for his shotgun book, but an incomplete bibliography and lack of identification of sources (except where identified in the text) make it difficult to weigh the accuracy of some of the conclusions presented. Fortunately, Pat Redmond is working on a definitive study on the subject, and has been helped by several people (EricArcher and Jeff Moller among others) who have valuable information. It will be great, and I can hardly wait. I suspect it will drive prices up beyond their already outrageous level... John Spangler

# 1402 - Gun Books & Magazines
8/4/98
Don

I'm searching for a copy of "Arms Gazette" Magazine for June, 1977. It features an article on the guns of Marshal Bill Tilghman. any chance that you have a copy or could put me on to one?

Answer:
Don- Every collector needs to invest heavily in good reference material. I am amazed at people who will spend hundreds of dollars on a gun but object to spending $30 to $50 to learn about what they are going to buy BEFORE getting the gun. Not all dealers are as honest (or smart, or good looking) as Marc and I, so it really pays to do your homework. Man At Arms has some back copies available, so call them in Rhode Island at (401)726-8061. If they cannot provide, try the Highwood Bookshop in Michigan. They specialize in old gun related magazines. (616)271-3898. My favorite sources for gun books are: IDSA Books, Piqua Ohio (937)773-4203, and Rutgers Book Center in Highland Park, NJ (908) 545-4344. Canadians have a tremendous source in John Denner who can be contacted from our links page. Good luck... John Spangler

# 1397 - Colt Grips
8/1/98
Dean

Hello, I'm looking for the handgrips to a colt .44 revolver made > around the late 1800's. Possibly a Calvary pistol. If you know of anyone who has them for sale, Thanks

Answer:
Dean- Colt made several models fitting your basic description. The M1860 .44 Army and the M1873 Single Action Army had very similar size grips. Unfortunately grips are parts that often got worn or broken and require replacement so after 100-140 years not many original spares are available. I saw one set sell last weekend for $300.00 that were okay but no inspector cartouches or anything. Grips were individually fitted, so it may be hard to get a pair that will fit nicely at any price. Depending on the condition and exact model of you gun, and your preferences, a reproduction set of grips (actually they are a single block of wood) might be easier to find and pay for. These come in inletted but only partially shaped on the outside for $10-30.00 or take offs from Italian made copies being dressed up by the Cowboy Single Action shooters that will probably run about the same. A good restoration specialist can probably clean them or distress them to look good on your gun. Fakers can even add cartouches and the like if they do not get cut down by a bolt of lightning first. Hope this helps... John

# 1366 - RG Revolver
8/1/98
Stan USA

Along with make and model it has Miami, FL. stamped on the frame by the hand grip. I have researched this and believe that the manufacture is a West German Company named Rohm Gesellschaft (RG) Industries. I can not find any company with that name in FL. I would like any information on this handgun, in particular, the age and value. Thank you in advance.

Answer:
Stan, Rohm GmbH of Sontheim/Brenz produced cheap revolvers, starting pistols, gas pistols and alarm pistols for the U.S. marketplace during the late 1960s. RG revolvers were sold in the USA prior to the passage of the 1968 Gun Control Act and were imported by a Miami based company whose name I can't recall (hence the Miami, FL stamping). Rohm revolvers are usually identifiable by a round medallion in the grip carrying 'RG' and the model number. The RG-23 is a 22LR revolver with a six shot swing out cylinder and a 1.5 inch barrel. RG values fall in the $25.00 range... Marc

# 1347 - Shotgun- Riverside
8/1/98
tdonovan@ctc.ctc.edu

Looking for any information regarding this shotgun my Dad inherited from his father. Anyone know where it came from or if it is worth anything?

Answer:
This is one of the many trade name, or house brand shotguns produced from 1890 to about 1930. I think Riverside was used by Montgomery Ward... John Spangler

# 1346 - Bayonet- Swiss Schmidt-Rubin
8/1/98

Has a "+" on the handle by itself. This is a Swiss bayonet I believe, if you can would you tell me more about the history on this?

Answer:
Sir- These were adopted by the Swiss about 1889 when they introduced the Schmidt-Rubin rifle. They are simple, efficient, and rugged. The U.S. trials to adopt a magazine fed rifle in 1892 selected the Krag rifle, but also the Swiss bayonet. The US version has US instead of Swiss markings (gotta make sure we mention that, people might never figure that out on their own!). The Swiss blade has either a little high spot or a rivet in the fuller ("blood groove") an inch or two from the handle to help hold it in the scabbard, and the rear joint between the wooden grip scales and the metal pommel is a slight angle on the Swiss version. I get fooled a couple times a month by these while looking for Krag bayonets. There is a wide variety of Swiss armament available for collectors, and I know of only a few who specialize in it. Relatively inexpensive field- maybe you want to gather some more. It is amazing that politicians who advocate more gun control (because having guns available must result in criminals shooting lots of innocent people, or so they claim) ignore the Swiss example where all adult males are required to have their government issued fully automatic assault rifles and ammunition in their homes. The Swiss firearms crime rate is about zero. Guess that proves that guns don't cause crime, but criminals do. Every chance you get, tell everyone who will listen that we do not need more gun control, we need more crime control... John Spangler

# 1344 - Sword
8/1/98
Ray, Rockville, MD, USA

Capital CK or CR stamped into center of blade just above hilt. Would like to know more about a Civil war saber that my in-laws gave me. It's a cav. saber, blade is about 32 to 36 ins. in length, brass hilt, two branch. The leather and brass twists are gone on the handle, only wood left which looks to be walnut. The blade is in good condition, but metal has now turned black. Should I try and clean the blade and brass hilt, or leave it as is in order to preserve it's authenticity. Just looking for the type and who may have made it.

Answer:
Ray- Certainly sounds like one of the many cavalry sabers imported from various European sources for use during the Civil War. I cannot immediately identify the CK or CR marking. If there were three initials or it were stamped in small letters on the hilt or other parts, it would probably be inspector initials of some sort. On the blade, it is probably the maker. Perhaps French, Spanish, Austrian, or one of the many independent German states. They all took advantage of the eager buyers from the Northern and Southern governments to clean out their armories in 1860-65. Bill Edward's "Civil War Guns" does a great job of detailing what took place, although his focus is on the guns rather than the edged weaponry.

My recommendation is to not mess with the brass at all. If the steel parts have very light dry rust specks, rubbing with some extra fine steel wool (000 or 0000 grade) and a little WD-40 or light oil will remove it. If heavier rust, just oil it and leave it alone. How much to clean an item is a difficult question, and the owner's personal preferences play a big part. I guess some one could take a Henry rifle with maybe 10% original finish and the brass frame turned brown and go ahead and polish the brass and reblue the steel. Hey, it is their gun, and if they paid $10,000 for it, I guess they can do what they want. My buddy Guido might want to give the owner some cement overshoes and there would be a long line of Winchester collectors looking for him too. You will never go wrong by NOT CLEANING a gun or sword. Just a little oil on the metal to keep it from rusting any more is a good choice... John Spangler